We are betting an EC and get such results in L/W
L
L
L
L
L
L
L
L
L
L
W
L
L
W
W
L
L
W
L
L
W
W
L
W
L
L
W
L
W
L
W
21 losses versus 10 wins. We need to bet everytime. How can we win?
Please do not reverse engineer this particular sequence to get an answer. The MM should be able to beat another scatter of same number of Wins and Losses. Any takers?
This would win 2 units if we play 10 spin series, would lose 1 unit played with seven spin series.
link:://:.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=13374.0
@Ati,
Can u elaborate step by step?
We start with betting 1 unit for ten spins.
L -1
L -1
L -1
L -1
L -1
L -1
L -1
L -1
L -1
L -1 At this point we are at -10 units, so at the next spin we start betting 10 units +1 for profit.
W +11 First spin wins, we are at +1 unit, so we start an other 10 spin series with 1 unit.
L -1
L -1
W +1
W +1
L -1
L -1
W +1
L -1
L -1
W +1 At this point we are at -1 unit, so we need to bet 2 to cover the loss and +1 for profit.
W +3 First wins again, the profit now +2 units, we can start again with 1.
L -1
W +1
L -1
L -1
W +1
L -1
W +1
L -1
W +1 At this point we are at +1 unit profit.
This was somewhat ideal, because we won the first spin after every raise, but we would need to bet until we are in profit, or we reach the ten spins, then we have to raise again the same way.
It might not be the best way to profit, just an example. And I doubt someone has the patient to play this way.
Ok,
Now try the same progression in this situation having same count of L/W:
L
L
L
L
W
W
L
L
W
L
L
L
W
L
L
L
W
W
L
W
L
L
L
L
W
L
W
L
W
L
L
error on my part...cannot remove..
Look at the previous decisions in the L/W registry. Bet for whichever is dominate in the last 9 decisions (L or W). Bet maximum of 2 times for a win, stop after 1 bet if you win then wait for the next dominant result before betting again. After each decision look back at the last 9 decisions to determine what is dominant (L or W). I got this idea from a post on this board but I cannot find it at the moment to give the original poster the credit. In preliminary testing it seems to work pretty well.
The original poster suggested using "The 5 Deputies" money management although I found that a little to risky for me. It seems to work nicely on the L/W decisions posted above.
@Dennisbelle
I am just asking to work upon the L/W that has come up to us betting an EC. Not asking for another bet suggestion. Just work out a progression that can handle such cases while betting every time.
Try with this, HP Johnson method
link:://:.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=11263.0
Quote from: chiricahua on Jan 11, 10:46 AM 2014
Try with this, HP Johnson method
link:://:.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=11263.0
Similar idea, well explained is here:
link:://betselection.cc/even-chance-8/can-you-win-5-bets-in-50/?topicseen
Sorry
@SUPERMAN,
Would you mind illustrating your way on both L/W situations?
Sorry
Quote from: superman on Jan 11, 11:16 AM 2014
Yes I would, was just feeding food for thought. Pointless working an exact progression for a historical set of data, the same patterns may never repeat so why bother.
You shouldn't have bothered to suggest your progression too. Beating only a particular favorable situation and boasting of that is like making fun of your own.
In the beginning of the thread I started with saying that, "Please do not reverse engineer this particular sequence to get an answer. The MM should be able to beat another scatter of same number of Wins and Losses. Any takers?"
Kingsroulette Your First result with my progression (TFprogression)
L -10
L -7
L -8
L -9
L -13
L -17
L -22
L -30
L -40
L -53
W 71
L -107
L -95
W 126
W 189
L -10
L -7
W 8
L -11
L -8
W 9
W 15
L -10
W 7
L -11
L -8
W 9
L -15
W 13
L -20
W 17
total -47 = -4.7 units
Just ot throw it out there for simplicity's sake
Standard FIBO +1 step on loss...-1 step on win
1st example +412
2nd example -91
Might wanna check the numbers...I did it quick and didn't check my work
It said bet every spin... but with common sense stop losses on losing streaks the numbers could improve...
FIBO of course requires a higher bank and you have to watch table limits
Roulettekey,
Fibo or labouchere normally works very well but in exceptionally bad cases they lose till table limit or bankroll. They are kind of semi-martingale with same kinds of outputs and fate in long run.
It seems I am among very amateure players who rely only upon luck to win.
lll. lll -14
lll. lww+1
lll. llw+2
lwl. lll+3
lww. wll+4
llw. lww+5
llw. lwl+6
wlw. lll+7
llw. lwl+8
lwl. lwl+9
w. -11. l. +10
warrior,
I failed to understand your explanation. Could it be step by step?
Quote from: kingsroulette on Jan 11, 11:42 PM 2014
Roulettekey,
Fibo or labouchere normally works very well but in exceptionally bad cases they lose till table limit or bankroll. They are kind of semi-martingale with same kinds of outputs and fate in long run.
Don't get all worked up... you asked for something that would work and stand a losing streak.
I even brought up the bankroll issue with the FIBO.
Once you start a progression you need to have the bankroll and intestinal fortitude to play it out...the big losers are those that play a portion of the progression and then chicken out when the big bets come into play. Can you lose it all? Of course you can and occassionally you will...it's whether you win more than you lose in the long run that counts. No guts...no glory.
If you are playing to win and not to just grind out a breakeven result after a long session at some point you need to bet big to win big. The FIBO won overall without ever being too strained so I threw it out as an example or model for others. I don't even play EC's because they are difficult to recover from. The inside bets just make more sense to me.
I'm sure you have your reasons for specifying that every spin must be bet...but in real life with real money the only players I see betting every spin leave all their chips with the croupier. Just a consistent observation over a couple decades of play...possibly your experience is different.
It's interesting when someone makes a comment of amateur and then wants to know how it's done.
If a bet can win flat betting on a 50/50 bet and you win 30 to 60 dollars your doing good , or lose 27 dollars after 100 placed bets your doing good because people lose far more then 2.7% betting on inside and out makes no difference.
Kingsroulette if you want to win 1 unit and quit after winning that then the challenge makes sense. If you have to play all spins even after winning 1 unit then thuis is rubbish. What if the first 10 are wins and the last 21 are losses :)
Quote from: warrior on Jan 13, 10:35 AM 2014
It's interesting when someone makes a comment of amateur and then wants to know how it's done.
If a bet can win flat betting on a 50/50 bet and you win 30 to 60 dollars your doing good , or lose 27 dollars after 100 placed bets your doing good because people lose far more then 2.7% betting on inside and out makes no difference.
I am calling amateur because not seeing any proper answer. None did both conditions. Anybody can reverse engineer a particular condition and "fit" a particular way of playing seeing that.
Quote from: RouletteMaster on Jan 13, 12:41 PM 2014
Kingsroulette if you want to win 1 unit and quit after winning that then the challenge makes sense. If you have to play all spins even after winning 1 unit then thuis is nonsense. What if the first 10 are wins and the last 21 are losses :)
Get at +1 in both conditions by same technique and it is good enough.
This "riddle" is interesting, since it gets to the heart of the question of whether a winning strategy is at all possible. And of course, the specific sequence of the 10 wins and 21 losses should be irrelevant to a "winning" strategy. I think that anyone looking for the "perfect" strategy should take rather extreme losing sequences such as the one Kingsroulette presented us with and see if they can come up with a strategy that, even if it doesn't come out ahead - will at least greatly reduce the lost amount, no matter HOW the 10 wins/21 losses are distributed in the series.
My feeling with this riddle is that, in order to (almost) ensure a final win, it would be necessary to keep playing, and NOT to stop after the 31 spins. After all, we all know that a day of losses is often "balanced out" by a day of wins, so the answer could lie in continuing to play, but using a larger betting unit upon continuing.
Yesterday, for example (at BV), I encountered the following sequence of L/W:
LLLLLLLLLLLLLLWLLLWLLLWLWLWWLWL (31 spins). To stop here would be suicide, no matter what strategy you use: I mean, 24 losses as opposed to only 7 wins???!
LLLWLWLWLLLWWLWLWWLL 8 wins, 12 losses.
So the question here would be: Is there a progression/strategy that would ensure, in the second series, enough of a gain that it would not only negate the losses in that series, but also recover a significant amout from the previous series, which could be viewed as that "series from Hell" that will eventually come up if you play long enough?
I'm curious to see what others come up with here!
nobody will answer because nobody have an an answer. They would merely "surrender" in such cases.
Quote from: kingsroulette on Jan 27, 11:21 PM 2014
nobody will answer because nobody have an an answer. They would merely "surrender" in such cases.
But let me guess, you have an answer ... Kingsroulette
O0
GLC,
Do u have any suggestion? You are the most prolific writer and debater of progressions. I thought that at least one among so many members could do anything.
Unfortunately GLC has retired.
I tried to solve this riddle but failed miserably. Surrender is the best I could do to perhaps lose the battle but not the war.
I think the only one who could solve this MM riddle is Albalaha, but I believe he is banned here. ;)
Therefore Kingsroulette, if you really want this answered, you would do better to post your riddle on the betselection.cc forum where Albalaha is still and active member. He alone can help you.
Cheers.
::)
.
I don't think he can do this. I think he has been banned in bs.cc too or going to be soon.
Quote from: kingsroulette on Jan 12, 05:33 AM 2014
It seems I am among very amateure players who rely only upon luck to win.
Do you have an answer?
Considering, you calling us very amateure players who rely only upon luck to win.
My suggestion would be a 4 spin cycle Marti with a stop and revert to base bet if BR in +ve. Marti progression starts at whatever the loss is after the first 4 spin cycle.
e.g.:
L -1
L -1
L -1
L -1 (-4) end single unit cycle
L -4 start of 4 unit cycle
L -4
L -4
L -4 (-20) end of 4 unit cycle
L -1 start of second 1 unit cycle
L -1
W +1
L -1 (-22) end of second 1 unit cycle
L -8 start of 8 unit cycle
W +8
W +8
L -8 (-22) end of 8 unit cycle
L -1 start of third 1 unit cycle
W +1
L -1
L -1 (-24) end of third 1 unit cycle
W +16 start of 16 unit cycle
W +16 (+8) BR in +ve revert to 1 unit cycle
L -1
W +1
L -1
L -1 (+6) end of forth 1 unit cycle, start fifth 1 unit cycle as BR still in +ve
W +1
L -1
W +1
L -1 (+6) end of fifth 1 unit cycle, start sixth 1 unit cycle as BR still in +ve
W +1 (+7)
BR +7 after 31 spins.
Second set of results would end with a BR of +10 using same cycle with highest bet being 32 units at spin 29.
You could also us a 2 spin cycle and start the marti at 2 units on 3rd spin and get and end result of +46 and +86 for the two sets of examples respectively, but the bets would escalate rather quickly with highest bet being 128 units in both cases at spin 27 in both cases.
Possibly neither of these would work long term, but if discipline is used they might win more than lose.
Being an amateur I really don't have a clue what I am talking about. OH, and I am not Albalaha.
Marty will only kill, in whatever way,u play it. Anyways, thanks to try it in ur way. I am sure, you won't play, in this way, urself.
Quote from: kingsroulette on Feb 09, 04:30 AM 2014
Marty will only kill, in whatever way,u play it. Anyways, thanks to try it in your way. I am sure, you won't play, in this way, urself.
Actually I do play similar to this and have been for a while, but I limit the Marti to 16 units maximum for 4 spins, my sessions are 32 spins maximum, not 31, nice even sets of 4 spins if it goes that way. I write off losing sessions after 32 spins or if the BR is -ve after playing the 4 x 16unit spins and start again at 1unit level. The funny thing is that I have not had many losing sessions (3 out of last 100 sessions). You only have to aim at 10-11 winners out of 32 spins and you are winning in most cases, any more than 10-11 and you are in clover. I use a method posted by Ausguy playing all 3 ECs at once.