What is the safest "grind" system?

[warrior]

The problem is the amount time you spend for very little return .

[GLC]

I think if you used a 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10-11-12 etc... bet line, you'd probably still be a winner on those numbers but a smaller win and less of a drawdown.  If it really is a winner and you have a table with a $5 minimum and a $1,000 maximum, you could make enough units per bet to make it worth the time effort.

I like tracking all three e.c.s and betting the first trigger.  I especially like it when two of them have 4 in a row at the same time and after winning the 1st one the other on hasn't hit after 6 or 7 in a row.  It's almost like a gimme.

For our guest readers, I have to say that I have experienced worse then you did on your 1,000 spin test.

George L. Coran

[ego]

Mr. Twenty cents 

Here's the system.  It's almost foolproof but it does require tracking and being able to focus like a lazer beam.

Track all three of the even chance bets until you get a streak of 4 of the same e.c. then start betting for it to end.  So if you get 4 Reds in a row, start betting for a Black to hit.  We bet an aggressive D'Alembert of 1-3-5-7-9-11-13-15 etc...  We move 1 level to the right on a loss and 1 level to the left on a win.  Any win stops the attack and we re-track for another betting opportunity.  If we're not at a new high after our hit, we continue at the same place in the bet line on the next betting opportunity.

If you get good enough, you can look for chops also.  We look for BRBRB this is 4 chops in a row so now we bet for a repeat of the last result which is another way of saying an end to the chops.  In this example, we would bet for another B.  A win would be this BRBRBB.  A loss would be BRBRBR and in the case of a loss, we move 1 level to the right in our bet line and we continue to bet for the chops to end.  In other words we bet for an R.  A win would give us this BRBRBRR etc...  Once we win, we re-track for another betting opportunity.  Remember to stay at the same point in your bet line if you're not at a new high bank.

At times you will have multiple bets going.

Also, play the same way on the 2:1 bets (dozens/columns).  Wait for a dozen to sleep for 6 spins and start betting on it using this line: 1-1-2-2-3-3-4-4-5-5-6-6 etc... Move 1 step to the right on a loss and 2 steps to the left on a win.  Remember to stay at the same point in your bet line between attacks unless you reach a new profit at which time you re-set back to the first 1.

Why not play the lines.  Wait for a line to miss for 12 times and start betting on it using this bet line: 1-1-1-1-2-2-2-2-3-3-3-3-4-4-4-4-5-5-5-5 etc...  Move 1 step to the right on a loss and 5 steps to the left on a win.

Streets?  1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-2-2-2-2-2-2-2-2-2-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3 etc...  Wait for a street to not hit for 24 times and start betting for it to hit.  Move 1 step to the right on a loss and move 11 steps to the left on a win.  The 1st win ends the attack.  If not at a new profit, start the next attack at the same point on the line.

It's not so hard to play for streaks to end on the e.c.s and also the dozens.  Adding chops to the e.c.s gets pretty hairy especially if you are also playing the dozens, lines and streets.

If you're good enough, you can play splits.  Wait for 36 misses then the bet line is adapted per above.
Straight up numbers.  72 misses.

That's my 20 cents worth.

GLC

George, this is a very good bet selection.
But i would like to add a twist to it and i will explain why.

You wait until you get four in a row, then you wait for the next oucome to show and play against it.
This is the reason.

Lets say you track the random flow and charting them in a straight line like this.

B
B
B
R
B
R
B
B
R
R
B
B

Now lets say you get four blacks in a row.

B
B
B
B

Now if you now wait for the next outcome you will get clustering patterns into groups of two.
Lets say we get red.

BR
B
B
B

As you can see so do you get the BR pattern and if you now bet aginst red for three attempts so are you betting against four patterns of BR to show.

BR
BR
BR
BR

If you had got four blacks and next outcome would be black again, then you would be playing aginst BB pattern.

So you are tracking and charting a common line of the random flow, but you are betting against clustering patterns of two.
And its gets better if you lose your first three bets.

Then you repeat the formula again after having two series of four in a row.
Then you wait for a new outcome.

For example:

BRR
BR
BR
BR

Now you get the principal of 1/3 and clustering patterns into groups of three.
And in this situation you bet three attempts again against red to prevent four patterns of BRR (that is a pretty rare event getting four of the same using principal of 1/3)

It even get more unlikely if you continue after this.
Then you would betting against patterns of four not repeating four times in a row.

This is how i would improve your origingal bet selection.

Here is a raw test just betting 122


01/9

+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
-5
+1
+1
+1
-1
+1
+1

31/8

+1
-5
+1
+1
+1
+1
-1
+1
-1
-5
+1
-1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1

30/8

+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
-1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1 

This also work using RBRBR patterns.
I would not use the both variants at the same time, because then you get higher variance.
As you can see above with over 20 session and you never lost twice or two in a row.

[GLC]

Bravo Ego.  My initial impression is that this may be getting as close to the infallible roulette system as I've seen.  It's certainly better than the system titled "The Very Near Infallible Roulette System".

Thanks for your improvement.  Not that my original idea was that unique.  It just brought out more interest and some different perspectives.

I have been waning in my roulette interest lately, but I'll have to play around with this a little and see if it stays a good as first glance.


GLC

[RouletteGhost]

Hello everyone. Im pittsburgh bound and will visit rivers casino. They have american wheels. Pointers? Been a while since I played live dealer

[ego]

Ego  I've jjust given this a very short test and it seems to work well. 

I've been  using my 124, followed by D'alembert on a loss. Long term, do you think 122 might be better?

I test d'alambert and hit a losing session that won in the end - that was a big draw down.
I don't think i can stand in the casino and be down -40 and try to fight my way back to +0 or above.

This show that GLC progression would work using with three attemps steps.
But you would need a big bankroll to fight when you get draw-downs.



Here you can see the 122 staking and you are up +7 before you hit the losing strike and stop at -4.
So the question is what kind of progression you want and what kind of playing style you prefer.



So the question is if you are going to test this using money management.
For example:

400 Session money
200 Loss-limit
  40 Win-target.

With the examples above i use only one EC ...
I test all three EC and reach +40 very quick

[Turner]

how about using lines as ecs. 

(gawwd....is Turner still carping on about that)

I'll do some tests

[RouletteGhost]

Lines as ECs. Ill look into this

[ego]

how about using lines as ecs. 

(gawwd....is Turner still carping on about that)

I'll do some tests

What do you bet against or with? (using your bet selection)
How many attempts for each attack?
What is the bet selection using the lines?

[RouletteGhost]

In my testing choosing 1 line from each dozen as an EC has a MAX miss rate of 13 in a row. Unlike the other standard EC bets. Waiting for 5 virtual losses then beginning with a negative progression is generally safe. Unless you are the unluckiest cat out there

I tested thousands of spins on testmystrategy and real world

[GLC]

Here's how I've been testing it using lines.  I track until I have 4 hits in a row of the same 3 lines.  if the 5th spin is one of my 3 lines than I bet 3 times on the other 3 lines.  If my 5th spin is from the other 3 lines then I bet 3 times on my original 3 lines.

Example:  I spin lines 2 - 6 - 3 - 6.  Okay now I've had 3 lines (representing 18 numbers) hit 4 times in a row so that's the same as an even chance hitting 4 times in a row.  Let's say my 5th spin is line 2.  That's one of my 3 lines and is equivalent to having  BBBB and then another B meaning we would bet for R.  So, in my example 2 - 3 - 6 would be like Black and we would bet on 1 - 4 - 5  which would be like Red hoping to hit within the next 3 spins.  Had my 5th spin been from the 1 - 4 - 5 group, I would have had to bet on 2 - 3 - 6 for the next 3 spins.  Kapish?

What this means is that our 4 lines must be made up of only 3 lines and one of them will have to hit twice.  This breaks our table into two sets of 3 lines each.

Of course we will be betting 3 times the units because we bet on 3 lines instead of 1 even chance.  That's the negative aspect of playing lines as e.c.'s.  The positive is that it gives us more options than one of the standard e.c.'s.

If you wanted to expand the idea, all you have to do is wait until you have 5 hits on just 3 lines.  Your 6th spin would determine on which lines you would bet and you could have a 4 bet attack.  With 6 hits on 3 lines, you would have a 5 bet attack. 

If this idea works at all, playing for say 6 hits on 3 lines and then using the 7th spin to determine which you bet on for the next 5 bets should be a safer way to play.  Howbeit with much fewer betting opportunities than with the 4 hits on 3 lines.

Your progression can be anything from a D'Alembert, a martingale or anything in between.  Like 1-2-4-7-13 for the 5 bet attack.  It costs you 27 units on a loss, but losses should be few and far between (most of the time).  Use your own creativity for the progression.

GLC

[GLC]

And again, if the logic behind this system is true, and mathematically it isn't but in the real world of 50 to 250 spins it might be , then of course, with a larger bankroll, playing streets would improve the safety at only double the cost.  I won't even go into splits or straight up numbers.  The tracking would be crazy.

Okay, maybe I will go into straight up numbers.  For straight up numbers we just look for 24 spins in a row where no more than 18 numbers hit (obviously some of them would have to hit twice) and we would have to bet for 18 spins to mirror the method presented by Ego.  The bankroll would have to be close to 18 times  the bankroll of playing a 1 unit even chance like R/B, E/O, H/L so you'd have to be convinced that it has a high enough strike rate to justify the risk.  That means a lot of testing or at least playing for tiny unit sizes which can only be done on-line.

A final thought for emphasis.  When tracking, we must have 18 different numbers hit and only those 18 numbers within the 24 spins.  If you have 19 different numbers in the 24 spins, you have to keep tracking until you have exactly 18 different numbers within 24 spins.  I haven't tested this yet, so can't say how realistic playing this way is.

I do know that if you don't start tracking from scratch after a win (or loss) you can use the last few numbers of the previous attack as part of you next attack.  This saves a ton of tracking and I can't see how it can make any difference in the outcome.

GLC