What Do you think to this .

[Kingspin]

I was playing at smart live a week or so back on the low stakes auto wheel.  I was winning.
Well number 30 hit but number 26 showed on the marquee!.
I have seen this happen before.
Now i have decided this looks very suspicious to say the least.  I am now willing to say that i am 100%
sure something fishy goes off on this wheel, i know i have posted this before and some have rubbished
the idea but my advice is don't play this  low stakes wheel at smart live casino.
They are cheating for sure , no question about it.
The way they do it is by video manipulation.
Thats me done wasting money with this rogue casino.

[iggiv]

i had such things happen on another casino, they considered number hitting right no matter what was on the marque. I don't think it's cheating, it's an error. Especially does it make sense to cheat on low stake wheel?
it must be an error

[Kingspin]

Well my friend iggiv you can think what you like , there is no mistake it's plain cheating. I can't prove anything
all i can say is that i personally really honestly am totally convinced they cheat on the low stakes wheel at smart live.  No one can prove anything but some thing is not right with the "wheel" there is no way on earth this is a legit wheel.  Now all the rubbishers will post and say i am gone in the head , why would they cheat lol.
They cheat to take your money is the simple answer. I watched this wheel carefully and have studied what happens with the ball and i am telling you something is going off with this wheel. There is in my opinion
some kind of video insertion of another spin been inserted at certain times. I don't think it's rigged all of the
time but they are i am sad to say robbing people.

[iggiv]

then get the hell out of there. I play this wheel too sometimes, never saw them cheating. But i know they do have problems. Once their server crashed and they did not even restore it to the state it was before. Also there were some problems playing with firefox.

[Iggy]

I have to agree with Kingspin. I played on there low stakes auto wheel many times and they cheat for sure.

I don't know how they do it but I would say stay away .........................................

iggy

[iggiv]

Well, i have been winning there. Not too much, but i have. Let's what happens after. I am OK with them for now

[ausguy]

What are these airball machines classified as by the gaming regulator ? Electronic gaming machines (EGMs), in the same category as slot/poker machines, RNG roulette & cards etc. ? or true random spins like a live dealer wheel?

I think they are EGMs because the spins are manipulated by physical outside forces. These being speed controls on the wheel as well as speed "adjustments" to the ball. They have small holes in the ball track which allows small jets of air to influence the ball drop. Speed controls on the game would not allow them by the gaming regulator to be classed as a true random roulette game?

Check out the Cammergh manufacturers site where they openly advertise this feature. If one maker does it surely all other wheel makers would do it too?

What you never see on any game is a notice as to its classification? Like slots/poker poker machines, I've never seen any sign posted where it reads something like ,"this is an RNG game and the results are manipulated so your chances of winning are poor". My local casino has a few notices on some slots/pokies which reads in part "your chances of winning a major jackpot on these games is no less than 1 MILLION TO ONE." 80% of gambling problems involve slot/pokie players.

Why? Because most players don't want to think about their game like they need to do with blackjack or roulette etc. Pushing the buttons & hoping for lady luck to smile is their M. O.
Many players seem in a trance when playing, have a look sometime & you'll see what I mean.

Remember all these "newer" games all follow in the footsteps of slot/poker machines in so far as making money goes (game programming). Slots/pokies still dominate the gaming earnings. Look at any casino site, slots/pokies dominate the games available. I have an account with smart live and nearly all their promos. feature slot/pokie play.

It's the same with air ball, they don't tell a player by way of any notice that the given results are not true random and that the machines are classified as EGMs because of this ?

EGMs have 1 common feature and that is the profit margin is adjustable. The computer program in the game ensures that the total return to players is met and therefore any audit meets the regulations. Audits only look at the big picture not a situation where your bigger bet was "creamed" by the manipulation. In order to achieve consistant profits the results MUST be rigged in favour of the gaming venue.

The gaming venue/manufacturers go to great lengths to make players BELIEVE the game is fair, even when it's not? Win the mind and they get your money. How many players believe that RNG is fair? How many believe air ball is the same as live dealer?
The main carrot they use is lower betting amounts than live dealer roulette. Obviously it works as more people have 10 or 20 bucks/quid to spend than 100 or 200 etc.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, FOR THE PLAYER, EGMs ALLOW THE CASINO TO LEGALLY CHEAT YOU.

[iggiv]

If this is UK, i don't think they really cheat. Anyway, it makes sense to cheat only with high rollers. What sense does it make to cheat to get 20 bucks from the players? they won't mess with it. There are lots of players out there.
One is losing, another one is winning.

but if some inspection checks them and finds out, this casino will get into a big trouble

[ausguy]

IG - I don't agree with your logic there. High rollers usually wouldn't be playing on low limit games?

Thousands of "20 bucks" losing players adds up to long term lucrative profits for the casino. Otherwise why do they have low limit tables ?  Why not then have the same limits for all types of games ? Slots/pokies make good profits. There's plenty here in OZ that have 1 cent plays that still give the venue good profits.

So IG do you believe that SL air ball spins has the same Random fairness as live dealer spins ?

Do you believe there is nil spin manipulation ? Do you think these wheels are NOT electronic gaming machines  (EGMs)?  EGMs are by regulation allowed to "cheat" the player.

Your "one losing, another one is winning" idea is more likely to be one winning and two losing in reality.

I'll try and do a search on Smart Live live air ball to see what class of game it is ? From memory I think they operate out of Malta & so are controlled by their gaming regulations.

Game regulations seem pretty much the same in many countries. It links in to International money laundering crimes. In the USA this is the main reason they prevent overseas accounts and thus restricted play choices.

[iggiv]

Аusguy, this is NOT RNG. This is a slingshot roulette. RNG is a different story, it's hard to check the software for being honest. On the other hand a mechanical system is not that hard to check.

Doesn't matter. Maybe it's all rigged. I am gonna play it and if i feel it is rigged as u say i am gonna tell u.
Not interested to argue, sorry.

[ausguy]

IG - There's a difference between a discussion & an argument. I'm only trying to impart information that it is likely SL air ball "cheats" players out of their money, how this can be thought of as arguing is beyond my understanding?

I realise it's not RNG, I never said anywhere it was. You're not telling me anything I don't already know regarding slingshot/airball roulette.

I've found that Smart Live is regulated in the UK by the Gaming Commission.
It's difficult to work out where air ball fits in their rules. It seems to depend on whether the wheel is free spinning for true random results, the same as a live dealer spun wheel or a controlled spin device?
If the spins have programmed control then as I've already said it then falls under the EGM (electronic gaming machine) banner as per the UK Gaming Commission Regs. EGM includes RNG games as well mechanically controlled games that alters the true random nature of the results.
EGM games have different classes including RNG games which are just one of many in the group.
All this info. is on Game reg. site.

The SL is an electro/mechanical system. You say that it is not that hard to check ? How would do that ?

I've played SL air ball many times in the past & NEVER won. I stopped in 2010 because I felt it was rigged. I've played SL live dealer & have had some wins, about the same as B & M live dealer wheel. Just like night & day, there is a difference.
You IG would seem to be one of the few lucky players to be ahead on SL air ball, some others, including myself, on here have lost money.

What's needed with on line gaming is more available open disclosure on the operation of games.
   

[iggiv]

i did not find any big difference between sling and live dealer (a person). Maybe that's just me. So far i am gonna treat it like a real live wheel.

[ausguy]

IG - What BR & level of betting are you going to on this game ? What bets are you playing ? Inside/outside?
If you're betting off 10p you may not be a "target" for the game program
(I'm assuming it has one) ? If I recall you don't like to stay with a game for too long ?

Only winning small amounts, for me, is not of much value in the overall scheme of life/living ?

For me play has to at least pay close to average workers hourly/daily rate otherwise it's better to get a 2nd job or similar.

All the best with your play.

[iggiv]

i do not win significant amounts. But i will pay attention at what u say and if i start playing bigger , i will tell u how i am doin

[Kingspin]

Once you start betting bigger on the small stakes wheel you can bet on any amount of numbers you like but they ALWAYS miss.
I bet £100 with a bet spread and they divert the ball to loosing pockets. I know some will laugh at this , it sounds crazy but i see a pattern develop with it. This is over a few years playing it so i know the feel of when they are manipulating things. I have quit playing
at smart live for good. One other thing i notice there on the small stake air ball at smart live is that when i am playing i cannot see the names of other players at the wheel.  There names used to show on the console but for some time now no names appear.