Double the fun

[GLC]

Very impressive Atlantis.


The first chance I get, I'm going to give it a spin on the airball machine at the new Casino Del Sol.


It has a $20 dollar maximum bet, but it looks like that's plenty of room to play the system.


@Sam  I love your video.  Thanks for all the work you put into it.  The best thing is that you got paid 10 bucks to make it.


I see what you mean when you say the progression can handle 20+ losses.


It may be boring, but it's effective and when your bank grows big enough, you can just play for larger units.  Eventually, your bets will get big enough to overcome the boring part.


Good luck to ya.


GLC


P.S.  Looks like the double dozens have been eliminated all together.  I can't blame you.    Who needs them when you can win on the singles?

[TwoCatSam]

Thanks, George.  I'll pass that compliment along to all the good folks at TwoCat Productions!

Sam

[vladir]

Oh boy... First time I looked at this topic it was 2 Dozens... now I come and it's only 1? :S  Guess I will have to read the 4 pages to get it...

[Tomla021]

vladmirov if you cant read 4 pages ? where has life gone? --you can hire readers?

[TwoCatSam]

From 236 to 262.

[vladir]

Ahah. I read everything. I played like 2cat about 100 spins, ended up in a small proffit, no relevan DD, as I was playing with 10cent bets...  And I must say he's rigth... It's boring as hell...

[Le_Chiffre]

so we have a potential grail.....but it turns out....it's too boring 

[ilukan]

What's your contingency plan if you column/dozen goes to sleep for over 20 spins?  It happened to me not too long ago.  Cost me 500 units, my stop-loss.  Fortunately they were only quarters, but 500 quarters still stings a little in today's economy.


You know the drill, after missing for 12 in a row, I was thinking, "This things gotta hit next spin."  Nope, okay next spin.  Nope, okay next spin.  Nope.  Come on, I can't be that unlucky.  Yep, yep, yep all the way to 22 misses and 500 units.  Fortunately I wasn't using a marty or a fibby and I had just gotten my allowance.  Thanks mom.


All kidding aside, you do know dozens can sleep longer than Rip VanWinkle?  Will A's progression handle it?


Worried for you


GLC

Many times even over 20 spins,and one can't cover each other while both sides showing same performance.

[atlantis]

To GLC: Just again to state it wasn't my pretension or objective to change, hijack or influence this thread against your original idea and I hope that you will understand and realise that.

JL has said before that I have a zeal and propensity for morphing and adding to systems, but I can assure all that it is done with nothing but the very best of intentions.

Yes GLC and Ilukan are right. Sleeping doz/col can be big danger, of course...

I've seen sleepers in my games today - dozens which slept 15, 16 spins or so. To use an expression by JL: "I wasn't there when it happened."

Although winning, I am sure TCS will eventually hit such a run - cannot escape it forever live or rng.

I can only say again that I am not betting every spin or the same way that Sam is playing it. There are many other single doz/col systems around posted on this forum that show promise that can be investigated in conjunction with the progression that I laid out. Not all require bets every spin. I mentioned JL's "zone derivative" I am using called "Crossplay" for instance.
It requires a small amount of patience when played live but not too long before qualifiers or triggers for betting will occur.

Perhaps other authors who have posted dozen systems can try THEIR selection methods with this progression strategy and report back on how they fare? If I remember rightly there were a group of interesting ones posted recently that seemed a worthy avenue of exploration.

A.

[TwoCatSam]

Guys

With the permission of GLC and Atlantis, I will published a further morphed version of this idea.  It will be called the GLAT SYSTEM FOR DOZENS AND COLUMNS.

GL=George
AT=Atlantis.

I've already written it up; just have to cut and paste. 

It's easier and not as boring and it is literally begging to be included in the ExcelBot!!   

Samster

[atlantis]

Ok. I will start the ball rolling with a dozen system and then show the w/l strings beneath.
Sam - I look forward to your revision naturally.

"BALANCE OF FIVE" Variation by Atlantis

(Wiesbaden spins 21. Jun 2012 table #3)
S   #   Type      W   L   Net   Bal.   Bet
============================

1   29   No Bet   0   0   0   0   500   
2   21   No Bet   0   0   0   0   500   
3   13   No Bet   0   0   0   0   500   
4   14   No Bet   0   0   0   0   500   
5   10   Bet   1   3   -1   2   502   1 : 1st Dozen       W
6   34   Bet   1   3   -1   2   504   1 : 3rd Dozen       W
7   33   Bet   1   3   -1   2   506   1 : Column C      W= TARGET GAINED. STOP
8   23   No Bet   0   0   0   0   506   
9   35   No Bet   0   0   0   0   506   
10   13   Bet   1   0   -1   -1   505   1 : 1st Dozen       L
11   28   No Bet   0   0   0   0   505   
12   21   Bet   1   3   -1   2   507   1 : Column C       W
13   9   No Bet   0   0   0   0   507   
14   14   Bet   1   3   -1   2   509   1 : Column B    W
15   6   No Bet   0   0   0   0   509   
16   17   Bet   1   0   -1   -1   508   1 : 3rd Dozen    L
17   5   No Bet   0   0   0   0   508   
18   5   No Bet   0   0   0   0   508   
19   36   No Bet   0   0   0   0   508   
20   7   No Bet   0   0   0   0   508   
21   11   Bet   1   0   -1   -1   507   1 : 2nd Dozen      L
22   6   No Bet   0   0   0   0   507   
23   30   No Bet   0   0   0   0   507   
24   27   No Bet   0   0   0   0   507   
25   9   Bet   1   0   -1   -1   506   1 : Column A         L
26   21   Bet   1   0   -1   -1   505   1 : Column B       L
27   18   No Bet   0   0   0   0   505   
28   7   No Bet   0   0   0   0   505   
29   28   Bet   1   3   -1   2   507   1 : 3rd Dozen        W
30   0   No Bet   0   0   0   0   507   
31   26   No Bet   0   0   0   0   507   
32   34   Bet   2   0   -2   -2   505   2 : 2nd Dozen       L
33   24   Bet   2   0   -2   -2   503   2 : 1st Dozen        L
34   17   No Bet   0   0   0   0   503   
35   4   No Bet   0   0   0   0   503   
36   31   No Bet   0   0   0   0   503   
37   22   No Bet   0   0   0   0   503   
38   19   Bet   2   0   -2   -2   501   2 : Column C        L
39   32   Bet   2   6   -2   4   505   2 : Column B          W
40   33   Bet   2   0   -2   -2   503   2 : 1st Dozen         L
41   31   No Bet   0   0   0   0   503   
42   0   No Bet   0   0   0   0   503   
43   13   Bet   3   9   -3   6   509   3 : 2nd Dozen          W
44   14   Bet   1   3   -1   2   511   1 : Column B           W
45   24   Bet   1   3   -1   2   513   1 : Column C            W
46   13   Bet   1   0   -1   -1   512   1 : 3rd Dozen           L
47   13   No Bet   0   0   0   0   512   
48   6   No Bet   0   0   0   0   512   
49   4   Bet   1   0   -1   -1   511   1 : Column B              L
50   27   No Bet   0   0   0   0   511   
51   21   No Bet   0   0   0   0   511   
52   12   No Bet   0   0   0   0   511   
53   6   No Bet   0   0   0   0   511   
54   27   Bet   1   0   -1   -1   510   1 : Column A            L
55   1   No Bet   0   0   0   0   510   
56   17   Bet   1   3   -1   2   512   1 : 2nd Dozen             W
57   24   No Bet   0   0   0   0   512   
58   4   No Bet   0   0   0   0   512   
59   29   Bet   1   3   -1   2   514   1 : 3rd Dozen             W
60   30   No Bet   0   0   0   0   514   
61   7   No Bet   0   0   0   0   514   
62   2   Bet   1   0   -1   -1   513   1 : 2nd Dozen              L
63   16   No Bet   0   0   0   0   513   
64   7   No Bet   0   0   0   0   513   
65   32   Bet   1   3   -1   2   515   1 : 3rd Dozen               W

+15 using best of five progression; highest bet=3

Result using W/L strings (MODE 3)
============================
@ 1U
====
WWW                        +6   SO UP 1
@ 2U
=====
LWWLLL                   +6  SO SAME
@ 2U
====
LWWLLW                  +12  SO UP 1
@ 3U
====
LWWW                       +27  SO UP 1
@ 4U
====
LLLWWL                   +27   SO SAME
@ 4U
====
W                                 +35    (END)
     

Correction: +35 PTS in 26 bets over 65 spins.

A.

[TwoCatSam]

Atlantis

I have hit a rubber stump and bounced back!

What do you do if you get:

LWWLWW

OR

WLLLWW

I can't find that occurrence in your post.

Sam

[GLC]

Here's another progression to be considered.


LLLLLW = Continue to bet 1 unit until you have a Win then add +1 to your bet.  If the Win comes before 5 L's, it's covered below.
LLLLW = +1 unit for next round
LLLWW = Stay the same for next round
LLWWW = +1 unit for next round
LWWWW = -3 units for next round
WWWWW = -6 units for next round

Play until you reach a new profit then reset.

Rationale for bet adjustments.

LLLLLW = +1   We have just lost 5 or more bets in a row, so we can expect to Win soon therefore we want to increase our bet size so we can recover more quickly.  But we don't want to increase our bet size too much just in case we continue our losses.  Any time we have 5 L's in a row, we don't raise our bet until we have a Win.  This can save us a lot of units if we find ourselves betting on that notorious sleeper dozen.

LLLLW  = +1  Same as above, except we start a new line after 4 L's and 1 W.  The Win doesn't have to come at the end of the 5 bets.  It can be anywhere.  We're looking for 4 L's and 1 W. LLWLL or LWLLL or even WLLLL.

LLLWW = 0  We have actually won a unit when we have 3 L's and 2 W's in any order.  We've had better than expected wins, so not expecting to have more wins than losses coming up.  Therefore no bet size change.

LLWWW = +1  We are winning with this set and if we haven't recovered our losses, we hope to continue our winning streak.

LWWWW =  -3 We are having a strong win and don't want to jeopardize our recovery by continuing with large bets, so we can drop our bet size substantially.

WWWWW = -6  Most of the time, we will have recovered all losses with 5 wins in a row.  If not, we can for sure take a big step back to guard against more large losses.

Any time we are within a few units of a full recovery and we're betting larger units, we should drop our unit size to just enough to reach a new profit with a LLWWW set.  So if we find ourselves at -3 units and we've been betting 6 units per spin, we can drop to 1 unit per spin because LWLWW would give us +4 -3 = +1

This is not as aggressive as Atlantis' progressions and so would work well with Sam's bet selection method.

All progressions have pros and cons.  No progression is right for everyone.  Try different progression ideas on the same spins and see how they compare.

GLC

[atlantis]

Hi Sam,

I have highlighted in red inside the correct progression rules below:

Use WIN/LOSS "strings" (W/L)  for the outcomes (max of 6 results per string)

Progression:

Up 1 unit after 5 L's in a row in a string.

Up 1 unit if there are 3 W's in a row in a string.

Up 1 unit if there are 5 L's out of the 6 results in a string.

Up 1 unit if there are 3 W's or more out of the 6 results in a string.

IMPORTANT: Start new w/l record string at each new level of betting.

Suggested stop point:
After a winning string and in new profit.

Recommended stop point:
After 2 consecutive winning strings and in new profit.
After 2 winning strings separated by level string results and in new profit.

[But of course you may stop on any profit during or after the end of a string e.g.: +2; +3....etc...]

Example strings:
LLLLL - 5 L's in a row so up 1 unit and start new string
LLWWW - 3 consecutive w's in a row so up 1 unit and start new string
LWLWLW - 3 out of 6 w's so up 1 unit and start new string
LLWLLW - 4 L's and 2w's = level so start new string at same unit level
LLLLWW - 4 L's and 2w's = level so start new string at same unit level
WWW -  3 consecutive w's in a row so up 1 unit and start new string
LLLWLL - 5 out of 6 L's so up 1 unit and start new string
LWWLWW - Over 3 out of 6 w's so up 1 unit and start new string

You said:

What do you do if you get:

LWWLWW

OR

WLLLWW ?

Well in modes 1 and 2 you would play until the end of the string
In caution mode 3 you would do for example:

LW        +1 reset
W           +3 reset
LW         +4 reset
W           +6 reset

and then your second example:

W               +8 reset
LLLWW    +9 reset
....

Most of logic behind it as GLC says.. Thanks.
Atlantis.

[TwoCatSam]

Thanks, Atlantis.

I should have seen that.

Sam