Vaddis Holy Grail

[Kan@am@]

Better to waste your time, instead of hitting the bottle

Words written with gold.

[The General]

Yeah, Vaddi is a tough riddle because we don’t know of anyone that’s managed to pin it it down.  Gordon and a few others have managed to do well adding a few of the core principals to other methods of play though, enough to where even if they’re not 100% they’re close enough.

Last year I tested tens of thousands of real world spins on wheel neighbors, their forward pairs, and splitting (betting a forward pairing of a number that’s already shown), trying to see if any of the individual pieces of the Vaddi puzzle could be isolated. As Ben mentioned, some of the tests showed long runs of success, but ultimately were close enough to EV that I didn’t feel they were anything close to being reliable winners.

Splits always arrived late in cycles though, often enough that just going after them using a progression had above +EV results for long periods.  Playing them starting after spin 24 or so to arrive before spin 37 did extremely well. It was strong during extended tests, so much so that I though it might be something that could be built on, but occasionally a cycle would go by without a hit and the session would lose and examining the “why” of the failure didn’t lead to any additional clues. Trail went cold...

Still fun to waste time on the mystery...real or not. 

The search continues.

You guys are so gullible that it's scary 



A word of advice... don't try and help the Nigerian prince if you receive his email.

[Bigbroben]

[Mako]

Better to waste your time, instead of hitting the bottle

Hey now, who says I'm not hitting the bottle...helps the testing go by faster...and the results get better the more you drink! 

[Gandhi]

That is true.  If splits are to be thrown in the recipe, these nrs/alignments are to be considered.

Tests can look good for a few hundred/thousand spins: they show potential.  Still, sims I run can be resilient like crazy, giving 4-5% edge for tens of thousands of spins, flat, but all of sudden something shifts and it sinks.
Should we call a HG if a test shows better than -2.7% after a million spin?  It's better than random, but can always be blamed on luck.
Variance can last stunningly long on different tests, enough to be tempted to shout Eureka.  But most likely this would be a too early call, for half an hour and 10000 cycles later it can be back to expected loss.

Here is for example a test result I'm running right now, 1053 games down the road,so maybe 30000 spins.


Could stop right there, start a new thread, say ''I wish I could share openly Roulette Grail'', shoot a few lines, comments, mysteries, yell: '' See you in a million dollars'' and head to the casino.

Vaddi had NOT made a million dollars yet when he published his clues.  Maybe he had been onto it for a few years, max, this would hardly be a thousand days or game starts.  Too early to call, according to variance behavior.  If he's making about 1u per spin, and putting no more than 8 units on the board, that is +10-15% edge.  This can happen for a few thousand spins, I have seen tests doing so.  It can change for the next few thousand spins and even out.

Will let my test run for a while and will show results.

Great post and good job testing.  I was about to post a similar statement regarding Vaddi. If you go look at the older thread he posted in he was quick to talk about the grail and treating the casino like an ATM after one month but then you could tell he was still changing the ideas of the system. So why would you be changing it if it was always winning?

[Turkish4]

At the end of the day it boils down to timing. When do you enter to buy for repeats? Or when do you enter to buy the pairings?

I think most of us are in agreement that singles hit first then doubles will follow. And that there must be roughly 12 doubles in a 37 spin cycle. The only question is when do you enter?

It’s like if you’re playing stocks/shares/forex/commodities, when is the right time to buy/sell

[Bigbroben]

Hi,

Say you have these nrs:
16 24 1 29 19 28 16 ( new).  16 repeated.
Play 16.

16 24 1 29 19 28 16 30
Play 16 24

16 24 1 29 19 28 16 30 22
Play 16 24 1

16 24 1 29 19 28 16 30 22 16
16 hit again.  Win
Play 16

16 30 22 31
Play 16 30

16 30 22 31 22 ( missed 22 but it's ok, can't catch all repeaters)
Play 16 30 22

16 30 22 31 22 29
Play 16 30 22 31

16 30 22 31 22 29 25
Play 16 30 22 31 29

16 30 22 31 22 29 25 33
Play 16 30 22 31 29 25

16 30 22 3122 29 25 33 23
Play 16 30 22 31 29 25 33

16 30 22 31 22 29 25 33 23 22
22 hits, win.
Play 22

22 29 25 33 23 22 28
Play 22 29
...

That's how I interpreted ''Follow the wheel''.  Played and added nrs until a hit, did not stop at 8 or any amount of nrs.

Luck?  Still to be proven wrong!

Just for fun I've tried this again.  But instead of stopping on first hit I let the nrs ''catch back''.  Meaning: if there is a gap of 8 nrs between a repeating nr, and every spin adding a new nr as explained above, eventually, after 7 hits I'd be the adding the last nr out.  It sorts of ''catch up''...

Anyway, the game was fun.

[jono1167]

Just for fun I've tried this again.  But instead of stopping on first hit I let the nrs ''catch back''.  Meaning: if there is a gap of 8 nrs between a repeating nr, and every spin adding a new nr as explained above, eventually, after 7 hits I'd be the adding the last nr out.  It sorts of ''catch up''...

Anyway, the game was fun.

Great to see you back Ben. You always bring good ideas to the table .

[Still]

Just for fun I've tried this again.  But instead of stopping on first hit I let the nrs ''catch back''.  Meaning: if there is a gap of 8 nrs between a repeating nr, and every spin adding a new nr as explained above, eventually, after 7 hits I'd be the adding the last nr out.  It sorts of ''catch up''...

Anyway, the game was fun.

Didn't quite understand the difference here between the prior method. Would appreciate more details so i might be able to test this myself.   

[nottophammer]

Irish 88
Pairings, you might be better to take the 1st profit; clear the #'s and off you go again.

[jay]

Hi all,

I have been looking at this topic and think the number Vaddi plays could be between 7 and 9 changes depending on pairings, eg: last 3 numbers are 18,18,19 you can only bet 18,19,20
Could be wrong, do you think he plays both pairs or the one to the right?
and what does 24/8=3 mean I wonder?
Sooo confusing, what a riddle

[Korg]

Well.....
8 numbers --> 1 double line x2 and pigeonhole principle (7 integer) and.....

[Let Me Win]

The reason it's a riddle is because it's designed to be like that so people can laugh at you trying to solve something a troll posted many years ago already.

[nottophammer]

Well.....
8 numbers --> 1 double line x2 and pigeonhole principle (7 integer) and.....

?

[nottophammer]

Gitano and Jono
G if 8 is the magic number. I'll leave it there