For the MATHS boys

[RouletteGhost]

To each their own

Some people view roulette as a hobby. And do not care to increase prediction accuracy

For some people things like ktf are ample

Notto. How many sheets now?

[BellagioOwner]

ok... Martingale (as many players) and Andruchi later was actually one of the first contacts i had with roueltte. I have the "bad tendency" to overanalyze every system i find before i put my real money on it. I suppose that's good. That's why i put bad tendency in " ".

The good thing is that i test them to the max and i test them again mathematically and then sometimes if i'm still interested and not seen it as scam i am running it through RNG tests of 1M-2M spins. (random.org etc)
The bad thing is having done all that test and not just by 100-200 spins or few sessions testing i have NOT ANY SYSTEM SO FAR to be long term winner (and i'm pretty sure i won't ever, just enjoy the process of testing them i guess for math sake...)

Andruchi's one is no different system. The maths and probabilities about unique numbers in 10 spins, 37 spins etc are correct. Feel free to use them in any of your system. The catch is later on using the "Prpoportional probabilities" type. This is where all his math are going out of the window. He is hoping though with so much analysis before that point (and correct one) the average user will be confused or convinced that his system is a genuine winner. I guarantee you it's not and if someone wants me to prove him why (by statistics laws) he can PM me. There is no reason to overanalyse it in the post.

What I wanted to post is an excel sheet i had made soem months ago trying to thoroughly test the Andruchi theories and stats.
His numbers for probabilities of Unique numbers in set number of spins are correct even though not 100% accurate since his numbers are based on millions of spins.
My numbers in the excel are not based on millions of spins but on the statistical equation there is to get these unique numbers. So they are not based on millions of spins but on the EXACT calculations-maths.

For example the 23 and 24 unique numbers in 37 spins there arenot 20% and 20% but actually 19,91% and 20,43% accordingly.

Feel free to download the excel showing the mathematical type that was used and the exact probabilities for each unique number from 1 unique to 37 uniques.
I must say again. This won't change anyway the system or your odds of winning, but you may use it to any of your systems just for fun or sicentific purposes.

You're welcome.

PS: *** Applying Physics and Computers to calculate where the ball most probably will land and therefore changing even slightly the odds from 1 in 37 to even 1 in 35 or 1 in 34 i think YES, it can be a winning strategy. No. i'm not promoting Steve's systems even though i think they can make you have an edge over casino House edge. For the time i can't afford them and i'm not sure they would be legal in my country so not worth the investement here for me.  I agree though that Roulette Wheel and ball is not RANDOM but CHAOTIC with so many variables. so calculating the variabels can work***


TOO LONG/DIDN'T READ: I have tested the andruchi maths and stats. they are correct for the unique numbers only part and you can use them. I have also an excel you can use that has the EXACT probabilites for each unique number and the type used to find them with an example. This won't change anything. The andruchi system still won't work but you can use the stats for fun! You're welcome

[Azim]

BellagioOwner,

You are 100% correct in what you have said.
However, once again not everyone will look at a red fruit and say it's apple some will call it plum, some might think it's a tomato.
Everyone sees things in a different perspective.
I am not saying I am smart, I have said I am dumb.

[celescliff]

About the multi player game, Steve,  will we be able to see past spins?

[BellagioOwner]

BellagioOwner,

You are 100% correct in what you have said.
However, once again not everyone will look at a red fruit and say it's apple some will call it plum, some might think it's a tomato.
Everyone sees things in a different perspective.
I am not saying I am smart, I have said I am dumb.

Agree. I just post the true math facts for everyone to see. Everyone can use them whatever way he/she likes

And by the way. I think there is a way to "bypass" the house edge in the long run. You jsut have to know how much long run you can risk before losing. If you had for example a very very safe and low consistent earning system. What you need is a system that will lose (all systems will eventually lose in the veeeery looong run) but will lose very rare before you stop playing it. For example a slow system that can lose once in 1.000.000 spins (1M spins is like playing the system for 5 years * 365 days * 10 hours/day * 60 minutes * 1 bet/spin per minute. This is 5*365*10*60*1 = 1.095.000 spins ) So if you played something THAT safe for 1 or 2 years you would probably be in profit in the 1st year. you could stop. It's like actually stoping before the chances catch you. I know its MILES AWAY from being called mechanical Holy Grail but it could be worth the try. That'ssomehting i maybe could play in real money rather than just excel and stats.

[Azim]

Well that's it, waiting for a trigger and betting  is wrong, sooner or later you will be at the mercy of LUCK.

Let me start by saying this first.  VB has it's advantages and disadvantages. If things were as straight as in theory, I personally would use it. Not saying it to agree with Steve.
It had crossed my mind years ago, however it wasn't worth looking into it for various reasons. From where I am the disadvantages out numbered the advantages.
Considering now that we have online gambling, playing with computers at home in our comfort zone has made it worse.
Made it worse you ask, we play more spins now than we ever would have played in the past.
Having to play more spins we are seeing what a run from hell is doing to people who are waiting for triggers. We have to be careful in how we handle it.

Example: How would you cross a road?Now how would you do the same crossing if it was a highway?

I am hoping that will clarify some off the concepts of "IT WON'T WORK", house edge has always been there and will always be there. Be it VB or manual playing.

[MrJ]

Thats why I commented regarding KTF, so in 54 days its a HG (or a great method)? Cant be, not that fast. My guideline is >> After 5 years on the board, if the thread is still very ACTIVE with CLAIMS of making tens of thousands, only at that point will I take a LITTLE bit of notice. Questions.....name me a 5 year method on this board that is "very" active still today. If you cant find one, why not?

Also, do you feel the KTF thread will still be active 5 years from now? If no, why not?
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Changing the subject >> imo, the biggest issue on this board is, whether or not its ok to jump on any thread (method or other) you dont agree with? I am ALWAYS fair and see both sides.

A) A method is posted and you dont agree with it. Is it "starting trouble" to POLITELY ask questions and give your point of view? I'm not talking about this moron >> "you'll never win you damn loser SOB, rot in hell"!!!! (lol) Not talking about that guy.

B) The opposite, say nothing and leave the thread alone? Like I said, I'm in the middle on this, I see both sides.

Ken

[MrJ]

In terms of VB, I have had several people ask me why I have not switched over? I use to rip VB quite a bit but I have moved a little to the center. I see its merits but the honest truth (speaking for myself) I have put in so much time/effort into what I currently do, I dont want to start over.

I dont want to re-learn roulette all over again. It does not mean I'm putting VB down per sey, I just dont have the patience to start over. I also dont promote VB. When I want to learn anything casino related, its balls to the walls for me. 1000000% or not at all. I'll never put 99% effort into roulette, never.

Ken

[Turner]

Ken....I see your cough has cleared up

VB (cough) 

[RouletteGhost]

VB obviously has merit

I do not have the time to data collect though

So at this point in time its not for me

[MrJ]

Ken....I see your cough has cleared up

VB (cough) 

lol, I forgot all about that. Do I believe in all AP style of play? No but VB *DOES* have its merits, I admit it.

Ken

[MrJ]

VB obviously has merit

I do not have the time to data collect though

So at this point in time its not for me

Geez, we half agree on something, cool.

Ken

[RouletteGhost]

Ive been asked by several VB guys to collect data at my local casino

As much as ID LOVE to i dont have time now

[whoisthewomanme]

I think it's interesting that so many people talk about the "long term".

How long is the long term? 2M spins? If that's the case most of us probably won't be playing in the long term.

2M spins if getting

[RouletteGhost]

I think it's interesting that so many people talk about the "long term".

How long is the long term? 2M spins? If that's the case most of us probably won't be playing in the long term.

2M spins if getting

Exactly. I test in 40 spin batches. Long term means nothing for us

Winkels GUT fails long term. What ? 1 million spins? Lol

We play for a couple hours. If the method is good house edge wont bite us short term. If the method is good we dont care about HE anyways

Also noone claims things NEVER lose.  Its roulette there will be losing sessions. Manage the losses. Have a stop loss

IMO systems will never work talk is pointless on a strategy forum. Why work urself up