Winkel´s GUT-Blog - Questions and Answers -

[winkel]

Hi,

first of all:
the Limit after 13 spins is 24unhit. Their can´t appear mor than 13 0s in 13 spins!!!!!
possible are:
24 fast
25fast
26normal
27normal
28slow
29slow
....
due to the small variance we can´t do any other explanation:

This is my exspectation after those results:
24
25 stops most of time

26
27 we have to wait for a more specific site

28
and more it might go faster

Your trot:
25 11 1 is fast - might stop - wait
spin 14 - Yes it stops - bet for Full stop
spin 15 - win - Full Stop - it has to fasten up
spin 16 - it does
spin 17 - it does
spin 18 - it stopped -
now watch: 1 1 0 0 1 .. what can we exspect? of course a 1 and then a 0 0? If one is wrong we stop! (Check the count of 1s = 9 10 11 10 9 10 11 10 9 10 ..>... 11 10 9
spin 19 R win
spin 20  new win
spin 21 new - wait for spin

we have 3 0s and 4 1s - Our exspectation is (normal trot) for the next 5 spins: 8 0s
we have 5 1s - 4 from this part - that is normally done! But we have a full stopped trot-part
so we bet:
First a 0 as picked above - If lost we stop and watch again
If won we bet 1s twice
If won stopp and wait until spin 25; If it lost once stopp; Give it room to do what the trot likes

[nottophammer]

Evening Professor
Upto spin 25.
I often see after spin 20, 2x become 3x, Ktf info is for spins 21-30, we could  see 5,0x's and 5 repeats,so how to get that 3x, is the >1x at spin 20 the expected at spin 25, so with KTF spins 11-20,6,+1 just above average 5,0x only 3,0x's since 13, should we not be seeing more in spins 21-25 we must keep an eye on what the 1x's could do as this is nearest for a crossing to develop?

Code Select Expand

KTF # 0x 1x >1x 2x >2x 3x >3x 4
1 5 36 1
2 18 35 2
3 12 34 3
4 15 33 4
5 26 32 5
6 16 31 6
7 11 30 7
8 36 29 8
9 R 36 29 7 1 1
10 9 28 8 1 1
11 10 0 27 9 1 1
12 11 33 26 10 1 1
13 12 35 25 11 1 1
14 R 26 25 10 2 2
15 R 0 25 9 3 3
16 13 3 24 10 3 3
17 14 22 23 11 3 3
18 R 22 23 10 4 4
19 R 9 23 9 5 5
20 15 20 22 10 5 5
21 R 11 22 9 6 6
22 16 6 21 10 6 6
23 R 12 21 9 7 7
24 R 26 21 9 7 6 1 1
25 17 4 20 10 7 6 1 1


[winkel]

I don´t really understand, what you are saying or asking.

I would just wait because the trot is slow and bet any crossings that appear 1vs>1, but I wouldnt bet the 1s to hit to chang to a crossing

[tuddilue]

I started to use the averages more to see "What is going on"

I uses these numbers for unhits 0x.
8 new numbers between spins 14 and 25
6 new numbers between spins 26 and 37
4 new numbers between spins 38 and 50

In combination to look at the flow of 0x and 1x I think this is really powerfull!

My question is, does it exist the same kind of numbers for 2x, 3x, 4x?
So you can better predict when those crossings arises? If you should bet on those or not.

- Tuddilue

[nottophammer]

Now you are getting there. How did Winkel arrive at, 8 new numbers between spins 14 and 25
                                                                                    6 new numbers between spins 26 and 37
By simulating 1000's of games ?

Me i'm no good at programming, so i built, manually a data base of my played games and got to averages of 7,5,3 for spins 11-40.
So knowing these averages you can make a decision for when to bet a non-hit(0x) or 1x or even a combination of them.
Why did Winkel give average info at 13,25,37 i reckon it was to go to the next phase of GUT, does he not say you could bet every spin if you can read the trot.

A bit on KTF, i only posted it to show how non-hit can be bet, i personally bet 0x and 1x according to the trot and taking in to account the LOTT.

[tuddilue]

Now you are getting there. How did Winkel arrive at, 8 new numbers between spins 14 and 25
                                                                                    6 new numbers between spins 26 and 37
By simulating 1000's of games ?

Me i'm no good at programming, so i built, manually a data base of my played games and got to averages of 7,5,3 for spins 11-40.
So knowing these averages you can make a decision for when to bet a non-hit(0x) or 1x or even a combination of them.
Why did Winkel give average info at 13,25,37 i reckon it was to go to the next phase of GUT, does he not say you could bet every spin if you can read the trot.

A bit on KTF, i only posted it to show how non-hit can be bet, i personally bet 0x and 1x according to the trot and taking in to account the LOTT.

Aha now I see the link.
7,5,3 is really good for spins 11-40.
8,6,4 is the same but more adapted to GUT.

So I'm just betting 0x and 1x crossings right now based on these averages.

But the question for me is how to do the same on 2x, 3x, 4x and more...
Does it exist some similar averages for these?

Because now I just follow the flow and tries to do an educated guess on these crossings. No betting just watching.
- Tuddilue

[tuddilue]

I found something that can be of help:
"The Law of the Third approximately 24 numbers hit, 12 numbers not hit, and 12 numbers hit more often than once in 37 spins."

So in 37 numbers 12 numbers hit more often than once.
If I remember correctly in the WTF thread we always talked about 9 1x in 37 spins so that makes it 3 numbers that hit 2 or more times.

So that can be an average that I can use in my tests. From 37-50 I can't find anything. But maybe time will tell.
-Tuddilue

[Scarface]

How does one know which crossings to play?  Are there any rules are guidelines for this, or just personal preference?

[nottophammer]

I found something that can be of help:
"The Law of the Third approximately 24 numbers hit, 12 numbers not hit, and 12 numbers hit more often than once in 37 spins."

So in 37 numbers 12 numbers hit more often than once.
If I remember correctly in the WTF thread we always talked about 9 1x in 37 spins so that makes it 3 numbers that hit 2 or more times.

So that can be an average that I can use in my tests. From 37-50 I can't find anything. But maybe time will tell.
-Tuddilue

Have a look at posted sheets in holy grail by Azim you see 2x usually become 3x after spin 20,note, obviously they can become a 3x before spin 20, which is what the 1-4 number brigade are after

[tuddilue]

Have a look at posted sheets in holy grail by Azim you see 2x usually become 3x after spin 20,note, obviously they can become a 3x before spin 20, which is what the 1-4 number brigade are after

Ok do you now where it is?
Because the thread is big like 80 pages..
-Tuddilue

[tuddilue]

How does one know which crossings to play?  Are there any rules are guidelines for this, or just personal preference?

It exists in the original GUT thread over at vlsroulette.
You can also read the GUT extension here at rouletteforum.
- Tuddilue

[nottophammer]

Ok do you now where it is?
Because the thread is big like 80 pages..
-Tuddilue

from around page 27

[RayManZ]

Could someone please explain me a bit better the slow, normal and fast trot?

This is for a normal trot
spin 13: 10-11 hit numbers 26 remaining
spin 25: 18-19 hit numbers 18 remaining
spin 37: 23-24 hit numbers 14 remaining
spin 50: 28-29 hit numbers 8 remaining

So on spin 13. We have 12 or more hit we have a fast trot. So far i understand.

Buuuuuuut....

From spin 14 till 25 is a new block. On AVG we expect to have 8 new number to hit. This part i find a bit tricky. When is a trot still fast? If it hits 8 or more new numbers? Or if we have a total of 20 or more numbers hit.

Example: We have hit 13 new number on spin 1 till 13. No repeats. So it's fast. From spin 14 till 25 we have 8 new numbers hit. That is normal. But on AVG we should have 18 or 19 numbers hit total on spin 25. We now have 21 numbers hit. Is it normal or fast?

Who could tell me better how i should read it?

[nottophammer]

Hello Ray
GUT is about the flow of the 0X's and then 1x's and >1x's, where they cross.
Now KTF is all about just 0x's, so there lies the similarity, the trot.

Countback can show you how fast the trot could be after spin 10.
On the attached is 40 spins just now on multi player.
You can see spins 1-10 had 7,0x's. KTF averages for spins 11-40 (30 spins) is 15.7 / 15.8 0x's, so i drop the point and have 15 to come in the next 30 spins. Half, so 1 0x every other spin as marked. So we could expect to see 22,0'xs by spin 40.
The small w is winkels points. okay.

So at spin 13, 10 have hit, the w says we could have 11 hit so 1 behind. But at spin 20 we show 14 have hit, countback the indicator of the expected 15,0x's, shows the 0x's have speeded up, 2 more than the expected 5. Of those 7 spins 4 are part of winkels expected.
Spins 21-30, is 0x straight away so still fast,3spins later another, now next spin is winkels point, we've seen 16 have come and 18 could be remaining, but theres only 16 0x's making 21 left, so the trot is slowing. Now next 5 spins,at 30 countback expects 17 to have come, but it must have speeded up as 19 have now hit.

Now a look into the future, what's expected at spin 37, the small w, also luck of the irish and winkel have shown we could expect to see 24 0x's.
So whats going to happen, if countback is right, then the trot should slow, but we still need 3,0x's in next 10 spins, so here like the Guvnor winkel says if not sure then don't bet, just watch.
GUT needs the 0x's to come to get to 24,0x's so the trot needs to speed up.
Well we can see it speeds up, gets 25,0x's about 96'000 of the 500'000 cycles(LOTT).
Countback shows its speeding up.
Attach 3 is just betting the 0x's +55 at spin 30.
So i don't know if this helps

[RayManZ]

That's alot of info. You use some different points and term then Winkel. So it's a bit confusing.

If i understand correct we got spin 13 25 37 50 to know if a trot is slow normal or fast. We use the blocks of spin to see if it's slowing down or speeding up.

Is that correct?