@ turbo

[Madi]

, I just try to see if it is possible to play flat and win long-term.

Holly poo. U already know to win flat

[wiggy]

One incidental comment that I would like to make is the following:

I used to go after both sleeping dozens and sleeping columns (NOT simultaneously) when playing this strategy.

The losses started appearing more or less at the same time at both casinos.

Over two-thirds of the losses were caused by SLEEPING COLUMNS.

And of the three columns, column 1 was the biggest culprit.

That was when I first started appreciating the fact that the uneven distribution of the columns on the US double zero wheel leads to anomalous behaviors on the part of the three columns.

Column 1 behaves somewhat differently compared to Columns 2 and 3 -- it tends to have longer sleeping streaks and it also tends to have slightly less frequent streaks (i.e. consecutive appearances) than the other two columns.

For me, the non-uniform distribution of the column numbers on the double zero wheel remains the single most interesting topic in all of roulette.

   

Well, the distribution is slightly strange if you break the wheel into 2 halves.
Let's say the first half is 16 through to 34 and the second half is 15 through to 33. (excluding the 0/00)
There are only 2 numbers from column c in the first half and only 2 numbers from column b in the second half. 

[TurboGenius]

If you are so kind as to answer the questions I asked you previously ... it would be fine.
There is something in the game that I like and another thing that I do not like, I just try to see if it is possible to play flat and win long-term.

There is no reason to flat bet when you have an advantage.
It makes more logical sense to increase bets as your bankroll increases.
It will take less time to reach your goal that way.
If the player has no advantage, then a progression simply amplifies the results
both good and bad - the math is clear in that case that they will lose at the house edge.
(Just they will lose more in balance because of the negative progression they are using with no advantage).

[DoctorSudoku]

Well, the distribution is slightly strange if you break the wheel into 2 halves.

Let's say the first half is 16 through to 34 and the second half is 15 through to 33. (excluding the 0/00)

There are only 2 numbers from column c in the first half and only 2 numbers from column b in the second half. 

Wiggy,
Another interesting feature about the distribution of the column 1 numbers on the double zero wheel is as follows:

The numbers for columns 2 and 3 are -- for the most part -- found in a few clusters spread across the wheel.

The numbers for column 1 are a whole different story.

Of the 12 numbers that constitute column 1, 10 are found in 5 pairs.

These 5 pairs are spread across the wheel.

4 and 16;

31 and 19;

10 and 25;

1 and 13;

22 and 34

Only 7 and 28 are found as singletons on the wheel.

The bottom line is that there is NOT one single cluster (or clump) of column 1 numbers that can be found anywhere on the double zero wheel.

[Anastasius]

A graph was posted earlier about the probability of 23.unique in a row ... I I think it said 0.0135 ect? Is that right and what is it as a fraction please like 20 unique numbers in a row has 1/10000 odds or whatever it is. Is the answer 1.3%

[DoctorSudoku]

Another interesting feature about the distribution of the column 1 numbers on the double zero wheel is as follows:

The numbers for columns 2 and 3 are -- for the most part -- found in a few clusters spread across the wheel.

The numbers for column 1 are a whole different story.

Of the 12 numbers that constitute column 1, 10 are found in 5 pairs.

These 5 pairs are spread across the wheel.

4 and 16;

31 and 19;

10 and 25;

1 and 13;

22 and 34

Only 7 and 28 are found as singletons on the wheel.

The bottom line is that there is NOT one single cluster (or clump) of column 1 numbers that can be found anywhere on the double zero wheel.

This is an addendum to my previous comment:

Maybe the fact that the numbers for column 1 are found as 5 pairs and 2 singletons  spread across the double zero wheel (or, in other words, no clusters or clumps)  can explain why column 1 has longer sleeping sessions and fewer consecutive streaks than columns 2 and 3.

That is just an observation and speculation on my part -- nothing more.

Anyway, back to repeaters and the HG ......

   

[Bigbroben]

A graph was posted earlier about the probability of 23.unique in a row ... I I think it said 0.0135 ect? Is that right and what is it as a fraction please like 20 unique numbers in a row has 1/10000 odds or whatever it is. Is the answer 1.3%

Column 2 is % probability  of a repeater happening at the spin in column1;
Column 3 is the %age of n spin-cycle that will have at least one repeater within;
Column 4 is the opposite: %age of n spin-cycle that will not have a repeater within;
Column 5 is the 1/x chance of a cycle going to next spin without a repeater.

So, example, on average, in 23-spin cycles, 7396 wont reach 23 uniques, and 1 will.

You could also say: if I bet on 1nr that hit, then 2nrs, then 3..., then 65% will end in profit or break-even on spin 9, with 8 nrs, and 34% will get past that before to see the first repeater.

[Anastasius]

Thanks bro Ben..holy lord 1/7000!!! Lol thanks that clarifies.. I guessed 1000... But its 7000 cycles

[Roulettebeater]

Column 2 is % probability  of a repeater happening at the spin in column1;
Column 3 is the %age of n spin-cycle that will have at least one repeater within;
Column 4 is the opposite: %age of n spin-cycle that will not have a repeater within;
Column 5 is the 1/x chance of a cycle going to next spin without a repeater.

So, example, on average, in 23-spin cycles, 7396 wont reach 23 uniques, and 1 will.

You could also say: if I bet on 1nr that hit, then 2nrs, then 3..., then 65% will end in profit or break-even on spin 9, with 8 nrs, and 34% will get past that before to see the first repeater.

everything looks good in your table except the word "cum"!

[Anastasius]

I believe the cum table refers to how many bj's you must give turbo genius before he reveals his holy system to u. Lmao 

[Bigbroben]

You bastards!

It's ''Cumulatif''.

[Ricky]

People ignore and deny reality all the time, it doesn't make them right.
The "wheel" is irrelevant - random is all that matters.
If a blind person picks ping pong balls out of a bucket randomly, I win.
If a RNG spits out numbers randomly, I win.
If some other device produces numbers randomly, I win.
The physical ball and wheel are only relevant to people who can't win unless there
is a defect in the wheel, but mostly they hang out on forums instead of winning
because these wheels are as rare as Bigfoot and in reality they want to learn from
people like me - who DO win thanks to random results on ANY wheel or ANY rng
in any casino or any simulation game where the results are random.
So ignoring reality and claiming the physical aspects of the game are how to win
is fine - welcome to the mystical "AP" players club.
(and yes, a bias wheel player is playing hot numbers due to the defect - but they will say "NO NO, it's more complicated than that !!!!" - but no, it's not. They are playing hot sections of the wheel due to the bias...... but a system player who uses hot numbers is a bonehead (laughs)).
Amazing.

Hi TG,
I'm playing devils advocate here and open to all ideas. As I have stated to Steve, I do not blindly follow "self professed gurus" but look at what ideas members have and test them for myself. I have reviewed what you have to say about repeaters and I can see the logic in most of what you are saying and so am testing it for myself with very good results I must add. The only thing I'm not sold on yet is the random explanation as to rely on random alone for the repeated numbers to come out is putting your faith in random not in a logical explanation why you tend to get some numbers repeating often in a short timeframe and others going to sleep. As I said to Steve, when I analyse the live wheel I think repeats can be caused by the dealer signature spinning the ball with a certain rythm and it landing in the same areas of the wheel more often than other parts. This to me is a logical explanation why you get rare events like back to back repeats or even triple back repeats.  I find it hard to link random distribution with repeats forming more often on certain numbers than others.

In terms of what Steve is on about with increasing the accuracy of prediction by looking at the physical properties and related variables he has a very good point as a way of approaching the problem. Its not the only way but is obviously a very powerful way as Casino fear this approach.

Roulette computers are not the only way you can identify a bias. Its not only a wheel bias that you can exploit. I mentioned recently that last Easter I was at the casino and witnessed a dealer having some fun with some gamblers just before close. He was trying to aim for a particular number and was consistently hitting a certain sector. The same numbers kept coming up. One observant gambler noticed this and placed 5 $25 chips on those few numbers where the ball was landing and ignored the other 32 or so numbers. Within two spins he won $1800 then tried a third time and it went to another sector of the wheel so he lost. But the point is by observing these biases you can exploit the situation and increase your accuracy of prediction

As I pointed out you can either use a direct approach by analysing the wheel and where the ball lands or you can view the effect of the actions - the repeats- as a way of exploiting the situation. So both your method and Steve's approach have similarities. Your idea of repeats is just an indirect method and you do not have to think about ball speed or wheel rotation etc.

But to claim a general phenomena with repeats as something that random dishes up with any more accuracy than random numbers I would not rely entirely on that alone. But I would not discount a system that, with the right stop losses and proper money management, is based on this concept of numbers repeating. I am currently testing how successful a system like this can be compared to random number selection on a live wheel. I will also test it on an RNG wheel at my local Casino and see which platform is more accurate.

Cheers,
Ricky

[TurboGenius]

As I said to Steve, when I analyse the live wheel I think repeats can be caused by the dealer signature spinning the ball with a certain rythm and it landing in the same areas of the wheel more often than other parts. This to me is a logical explanation why you get rare events like back to back repeats or even triple back repeats.  I find it hard to link random distribution with repeats forming more often on certain numbers than others.

Well, to begin with - this is a problem on your part as far as how you're thinking about it.
You can resolve this issue easily though by taking live spins from a live wheel and charting them (with RX or something similar). Then run off RNG spins, or import then from a source of random spins and you'll see the exact same events happen.
Then you can conclude that since the RNG sources don't have a physical wheel and ball, and dealer - that those things are eliminated from the "why" these things happen.
Sure, on a bias wheel you'll see strange things (Bias wheels aren't "random" and that's not what 99.9% of players are going to face) - and I've also seen dealers "aim" for sections of the wheel... it's a urban legend. When it happens, it seems as if they did it - when it doesn't happen.... it's just discounted. In reality, it doesn't happen.
A "normal" speed wheel going in one direction - a ball going in the other direction....
the deflects that happen when the ball leaves the track, the scatter all over the wheel until it lands in a pocket (and back out, back into another one, maybe back out again lol) - is all
the logic and common sense you need to know it's not possible.

Example - take a darts player.
A skilled darts player can hit a bulls eye - sometimes multiple times in a row of course.

Now consider this for a moment....
The ROOM is rotating horizontally, the platform the dart shooter is standing on is rotating horizontally in the opposite direction and the shooter wears a blindfold.
NOW - if you can tell me that the person hits the bulls eye now due to "SKILL".. then you
aren't being honest. It's no different than the dealer with the ball spinning one way, the wheel the other - the speed is NOT reliable each time and then you think that they magically hit that sector they aimed for ?  Be realistic and think about it.
Sure, the shooter will hit the bulls eye on the dart board - of course, the math says it's possible. But to then point to that and say "He's good ! He meant to do that" is absurd.
So now when it comes to hot numbers, cold numbers, rare events, patterns - you no longer NEED the wheel, the ball or the dealer in order to see how and why these things happen.
Those variables might make it random but they aren't needed for any hot or cold or rare event to happen. A person pulling balls from a hat, a RNG, atomic decay like in the video I posted.... any source of real random will produce what you think only can happen with a physical wheel and ball. Food for thought.

[Ricky]

It makes more logical sense to increase bets as your bankroll increases.
It will take less time to reach your goal that way.

I agree with you here. Using the Casino money to increase your bets is the best way to play any system. If you are in a losing position you should not increase your bets to recover losses. I learnt this the hard way. So any system that generates a profit should use a positive progression to amplify  the winning streak.

[Andre Chass]