@ turbo

[NextYear]

1st looked at roulette forums back in 20-6-13.
Learn't from Winkel, so thanks.
Now i don't think i'm going to learn anything more, from forums.
Goodbye to a few good members definetly not the wanker goldrosen

Have you noticed - 3.000 posts!

[TurboGenius]

Question for TG.....

What are you trying to accomplish?
What if I or someone post how it should be done ? What if someone code it and prove this really works? What if people see and read it and use it ?

Now what if casino's adjust there wheel or rules based on this method? 

You gave enough info imo. More than enough. To much actually.

I tend to agree with you - everything other than the specific progression is already available.
The casino could certainly make adjustments to the game to defeat this (and they would).
I can't help those who can't see past 1 spin as being part of a group of spins.
I can't help those who don't understand that repeaters are going to happen.
They just want to point to the next spin and say "What number is it going to be then ?"
They won't get it.

[Steve]

Turbo, you have said things that are simply not accurate. It's not a case of me not "getting it". I can and have pointed out the incorrect statements, but your response ends up being with vague information. For example, you said things like you never get 38 numbers in 38 spins. But any combination of 38 spins will happen just as often as the next. Then you say the cycle doesnt need to be 38 spins. But then its the same case, for any length of cycles.

I understand the concept of "what happens over numerous spins". But I myself have tested countless combinations of repeaters, and what happens with them over both short and long term. I used automated software to test probably trillions of spins. And except in the circumstances I already knew about, repeaters are no more likely to spin than any other number - either on the next spin, 2 spins later, or 3,4,5, etc.. And there appears to be no correlation to other repeaters. The only way to properly test this is with automated software, otherwise you wont know if results are good or bad luck.

I released free software for people to verify some of this for themselves. But in time perhaps I'll publish different software that's much more thorough. The problem with this for me is I'd need to create a censored version to protect some things, while still allowing anyone to use it.

[RouletteGhost]

Turbo, you have said things that are simply not accurate. It's not a case of me not "getting it". I can and have pointed out the incorrect statements, but your response ends up being with vague information. For example, you said things like you never get 38 numbers in 38 spins. But any combination of 38 spins will happen just as often as the next.

What you are missing, or choosing to ignore, is that in many of the 38 spin cycles there will be numbers that repeat 3 or more times

So potentially betting on a number that hit twice would create a situation where you are only betting a few numbers max

You have a structure to go by

And if you lose you make it up on the next cycle

I'm going to take some real spins this weekend and show you. I don't need millions of spins cause that's pointless.

[Steve]

What you are missing, or choosing to ignore, is that in many of the 38 spin cycles there will be numbers that repeat 3 or more times

Again I am not partial to any belief. I am well aware we never know everything, and our understanding and knowledge can change anytime. I am not choosing to ignore anything. I am stating facts based on my own testing, and the testing of many others who are qualified to do proper testing. My beliefs are based on this. And unless someone or something credible contradicts what I think I know, I'll continue to believe what I think I know.

I could say to you perhaps you are missing, or choosing to ignore, is that repeating numbers (including multiple repeats) does not at all change anything. It is normal probability and the odds are still the same whether it be for the next spin or whatever. Again, the testing supports this. The testing does not support otherwise. And until the testing contradicts what I'm saying, I'll continue to say what I'm saying. Is it unreasonable that my beliefs align with test results?

I don't need millions of spins cause that's pointless.

You are misunderstanding the point of "millions of spins". There can be 10,000 players with what they think is the HG. Each of them play only 100 spins. About 90% of them win, and are convinced they have the HG - and they rave to everyone about how they have beaten roulette. They win a combined $500,000. But the 10% of players lose a combined $510,000, then go back to the drawing board. So what happened here? 1M spins were played. Most players won, but the overall result of all players combined was a loss.

The winning players see no point in testing a million spins. The losing players understand better. How can you be part of the 90% of winners instead of the 10% which are losers? You cant choose. It's just chance. And that's how most systems either win or lose. And its how one person thinks they have the hg, when they dont.

[rouletteKEY]

So everyone is just gonna argue for the sake of arguing?

There are several types of players (sure I am leaving some out)

Computer players...use tech to try to predict the outcome

AP...bias players

Recreational...birthdates, anniversaries, uniform numbers and whatever strikes their fancy...just like the environment or wanna have a little fun

Sleeper players...because we all know it's due...it really has to hit now    right?

Wheel players...sectors and skips all the way

Felt...dozens and columns, streets and EC's    it's just way more organized on the table

Mystics...hunches, numerology...it's just in the stars or tea leaves and you gotta figure out how to analyze it and play it

Warm numbers...they have hit but not alot...but I wanna hit 'em while they get hot instead of recognizing the hot number and playing it when it eventually cools

Hot Numbers...this just keeps hitting so ride the wave

Now many people have some thoughts, feelings or play style that comes across multiple aspects and I am sure there are styles I couldn't rattle off in 3 minutes off the top of my head.  Didn't include the math boys specifically here as an ideology because they KNOW they are losing 5% per spin...so they just talk about it and can't play because it's not logical to intentionally lose 5% every friggin spin.

Point is...

    there's alot of different viewpoints here with thousands of methods on this forum and others...hell I think Ignatus alone has about 13,000 methods and they all win sometimes and then who know what happens because it's on to the next one 38 seconds later

   I have a certain set of beliefs and have structured a style of play that fits those beliefs and has held up well...I come to the forums to see if there is some out of the box thinking that can further refine the play.  Kinda like listening to motivational tapes or going to a business seminar.  98% is all the same crap I heard last time, last year, last decade...whatever...but there's that one little thing every once in awhile that turns on that light and leads to a breakthru and you never know where you are gonna find it.

   I didn't find it in this thread because I already play hot numbers...never sleepers.  I like the way I play...it works for me and I will change it if I ever see something that makes more sense and makes more money.

   The math doesn't mean anything to me...because I can't spend the math.

   If Steve's computers work...great    If someone can clock some tilted wheel that the ball loves a sector on...sweet    If your anniversary or kids baseball number happens to win every time you play it...I'm good with that too

   No one is gonna give a grail type method away but I believe everyone who gives serious thought and contemplation to the game at hand can win at this game.  Think about the things the casino controls and doesn't control...think about the things that are dictated by the house rules and quit worrying about 5% HE.  The casino's system works because of more than a straight house edge.  Think like the casino to figure out how to beat the casino.

   I guarantee the casino is not shaking in its shoes seeing flat bets and double dozen plays and if you are playing whatever number because it hasn't hit all day...they will give you a nice buffet dinner with the comps you surely earned if you ran outta money before the number hit...in fact it's probably on the marquee three times when you get back from that free dinner.

   Use the information you have to make informed decisions and then adjust to your table limits and bankroll.  Berating everyone whose math or 19 kajillion spin simulator software has a glitch or didn't give the expected or wanted result isn't advancing any discussion.

   I can make alot of math arguments for how I play and there are always technicalities that make for an argument that it just doesnt add up.  Do I have a 1/38th chance of winning on any given spin?  Yes

   BUT...if I am committed to a series of attacks with both positive and negative progressions based on average, long and short term hit rates derived from real play on real wheel and not some made up RNG then how exactly do you draw that algorithm?  And once we are that deep I would quit arguing and start working on a way to start winning. 

   My math never really touches the 1/38 because I do not believe there is an equal chance of the 16 sleepers hitting as often in the next X number of spins as the 22 that have already hit or the 6 unique multiple hit numbers buried in that 22.  Plus I know I have X number of spins to get that winner...the next spin is meaningless excepting that a winner on the next spin gives me the highest rate of return. 

   Why don't we just agree to disagree on some of these things because I know some are not gonna like the hot numbers...add progressions...add attacks instead of single spin outcomes and it can spin wildly outta control or right into your wheelhouse.  Either way the wheels keep spinning

[RouletteGhost]

exactly

[Steve]

So everyone is just gonna argue for the sake of arguing?

Not for the sake of arguing. For the sake of accuracy.

There are several types of players (sure I am leaving some out)

Computer players...use tech to try to predict the outcome

AP...bias players

Recreational...birthdates, anniversaries, uniform numbers and whatever strikes their fancy...just like the environment or wanna have a little fun

Sleeper players...because we all know it's due...it really has to hit now    right?

Wheel players...sectors and skips all the way

Felt...dozens and columns, streets and EC's    it's just way more organized on the table

Mystics...hunches, numerology...it's just in the stars or tea leaves and you gotta figure out how to analyze it and play it

Warm numbers...they have hit but not alot...but I wanna hit 'em while they get hot instead of recognizing the hot number and playing it when it eventually cools

Hot Numbers...this just keeps hitting so ride the wave

We, or at least I, am not discussing personal preference here. I couldnt care less about someone's personal preference. The discussion, to me at least, is about accuracy of information.

The math doesn't mean anything to me...because I can't spend the math.

We live in a mathematical and organized universe. There's a benefit to understanding it.

But nobody is telling you not to play however you want.

My math never really touches the 1/38 because I do not believe there is an equal chance of the 16 sleepers hitting as often in the next X number of spins as the 22 that have already hit or the 6 unique multiple hit numbers buried in that 22.

We'll disagree on this point.

Why don't we just agree to disagree on some of these things

I dont have a problem with that. This whole thing is going in circles anyway.

[RouletteGhost]

there's a difference between the math of the game and what the wheel will ACTUALLY do

[Steve]

Exactly how?

[RouletteGhost]

RG

It basically says jot down the numbers as they come and once you have 18 unique...play them as almost an EC

Once ahead...quit

must be some sort of luck/anomaly....performs well

[falkor2k15]

I tend to agree with you - everything other than the specific progression is already available.
The casino could certainly make adjustments to the game to defeat this (and they would).
I can't help those who can't see past 1 spin as being part of a group of spins.
I can't help those who don't understand that repeaters are going to happen.
They just want to point to the next spin and say "What number is it going to be then ?"
They won't get it.

Next spin vs. Next event is something I always hear being promoted by Pri and co as a valid comparison when in fact I think it's just a red herring.
Pri also said, in so many words, that 1 spin (1 number) is 1/37 vs. 2 spins (2 numbers) is 2/37. She failed to mention that with this increased odds (towards "1" or 37/37) that the cost also increases - so another red herring.

I am going to generate a statistic today that I think may help understand what is really happening here with repeats and Pri's spreadsheet - should hopefully shed light on where we may find this advantage should it exist at all.

But again: the above quotes are just a vague distraction/red herring. If TG has a winning repeats strategy I doubt very much it's based on any concept of "repeats have to happen" or "looking 2+ spins ahead", etc. And TG was one of the first to mention about risk/reward and cost/payout in the "basics" thread - yet "repeats" are always promoted in a disjointed manner, i.e. lacking context on one hand and detail on another. TG is now talking pretty similar here in this thread like how Priyanka talks in Random Thoughts - like a politician.

[Turner]

like a politician.

I agree.

Cloak and Dagger, could tell ya, but I'd have to kill ya, all in the guise of "I'm the guru teacher" and "lets get your puny brains working"

its just needy people with swollen ego's marketing their Brand name.

A brand awareness campaign, if you will.

The carrot on a stick only works for dumb Donkeys and gullible people

[TurboGenius]

And there's always the one (or two) kids in class shooting spitballs and not paying any attention to what's being taught.
It's not his fault.

[Turner]

what's being taught.

Thats the rub. Nothings being taught