“Biased” wheel players may win due to luck. Non existent, sort of like vampires

[The General]

Yeah, these three characters (fat, lazy and rich) apply to the majority here, including yourself

No, I'm USDA certified lean!

[Steve]

1- casino are forbidding users to use their phone, so fancy about a computer device !

If you are openly using your phone at the table, you'll be asked to step back. But with roulette computers the hardware isn't even visible. It's hidden.

2- how much is too much ?
Do u think 300 a day net profit is Headed to banning ?

There are many variables. $300/day is generally nothing. But any player that plays day after day will get attention, winning or losing. If you are winning too many days in a row and attention is on you, they may look into how you are winning. It's more a matter of time until they observe you more closely.

There are many parts to avoiding detection. But put simply if you're winning to much no matter how you play, they wont tolerate it. They'll deal with you one way or another. Casinos will more readily take action if you are making bets consistent with a professional system (like sector bets) because they know such methods work. But if you're making outside bets, but still winning lots, the casino staff will assume its just luck and probably not do anything for some time.

[Steve]

I am not the one that is wrong
Avoid detection? Paranoid?

It's far from paranoia. Casino staff are trained to detect professional players and consistent winners. They have courses on it, seminars and hire consultants. It's literally one of the biggest things casino surveillance does.

Listen, I will agree you can’t go in and make 20 grand a day
Have to be smart. Few thousand here and there and you won’t be “detected”. If you are really smart you’d have some losing days.

Then we agree.

[Steve]

Here are the facts.

Properties in Macau and Singapore, bet size of usd$1-2k per hand is normal in the public area. You get to see people win $20++k per session.

High rollers casino, usd$2-10k per hand. Normal to see members with $25k chip containers. Ofc there are the occasional higher bets.

About cellphones, not allowed near the tables.

If you use cheating electronic device you get banned. If you tresspass you go behind bars.

Surveillance is top notch. Just look up the ceiling for the eye in the sky that's everywhere except the restrooms.

I use to forget to take the cash from the casino atm, report and money returned to me within the day, that's how efficient. The same thing happened at the electronic table games, report to pitboss received a call one hour later to collect cash.

CHT, casino surveillance could be looking right at a professional player and have no idea. That includes my computer players.

It's harder for casino surveillance to find a well-organized professional team than for the team to win large sums without detection. Again there's a lot to avoiding detection, but its not difficult. In an average casino, taking $5000 in a session is easy. Taking $20,000 is borderline. Taking $100,000 needs ideal conditions and very careful planning. But then there are casinos an conditions where you can take say $50,000 without much difficulty. But doing it day after day at the same casino is not possible.

Often the best approach is large stakes but in ideal conditions, so the time of play is short, but edge high - so profitable play doesnt take long, and winnings look more like luck than professional play. It's not something I'd explain in detail here.

[Steve]

Guys please stop with the “being detected” paranoia.  It’s hog wash and I don’t know why Steve harps on it

RG, make up your mind. So you think the casino will allow you to win without any limit?

All the casino surveillance courses, all the game protection seminars, all the training and security procedures are hogwash?

[Steve]

My casino buddies wins and lose millions among them. This win $x thousand a day you get ban is plain nonsense.

If you win a few thousand with typical system bets, the casino doesn't give a rats ass. The casino needs the occasional winner, to give people hope. I never said a typical casino would ban you after small winnings.

But the exception is some online casinos will readily ban players after small wins, or even just behavior consistent with advantage play - as happened to some of my players. Online casinos operate in a different way.

If you win big you will be invited to their VIP platinum club for whales.

If you win big with typical system play, you may get a free room. That's because they want you to continue playing and LOSE your winnings.

I've never heard of an advantage player being offered a free room after winning a fortune.

[Steve]

 

Do you know why slots is one hell of a threat to them right now?  There's a very real reason behind it.  (And NO I'm not a sales rep for people wanting to play slots. )

You're probably talking about the Russians exploiting PRNGs

[Turner]

I've never heard of an advantage player being offered a free room after winning a fortune.

shouldnt we have an AP section where people can examine fluff in frets with like minded people, instead of mixing opposite football fans in the same stand?

Man City won the Premier League BTW watched by 88,000 United fans.....see? im never gonna listen to the Reds.

[The General]

shouldnt we have an AP section where people can examine fluff in frets with like minded people, instead of mixing opposite football fans in the same stand?

No.  By the way, Ghost created this thread, not us. 

You don't want to chop up these forums too much as it's distracting.  Really the only thing people look at is the list of recent topics.  Nobody really goes to the sections to find the topics.  If they do it's because the topic was recent or they're  using the search function to find an old post. 
Subsections are more of a convenience for admin and moderation than it actually is for the users/posters.  Besides, most of the posters these days are younger people that use cellphones rather than desktop or lap tops.  If you create subsections they're never going to go there if they have to open additional windows or wait for additional sections to load.  Ideally, less is more when it comes to message boards, at least that has been my experience running them. 

[RouletteGhost]

Yea Steve. I started the thread

To stop the predatory tactics of people like the general

He reached out to me and countless others via PM to monitor local wheels. Searching for a bias

There simply isn’t enough biased wheels in this day and age.

These wheels are monitored and are electronic

You need a nice size bias for it to be worth your while.

Nowadays hard to come by.

The generals chips are at the same edge mine are.

The wheels are manufactured differently now. Any bias is caught.

He’s full of shit. Like mr j has winning and losing days like all of us

[cht]

Yea Steve. I started the thread

To stop the predatory tactics of people like the general

He reached out to me and countless others via PM to monitor local wheels. Searching for a bias

There simply isn’t enough biased wheels in this day and age.

These wheels are monitored and are electronic

You need a nice size bias for it to be worth your while.

Nowadays hard to come by.

The generals chips are at the same edge mine are.

The wheels are manufactured differently now. Any bias is caught.

He’s full of shit. Like mr j has winning and losing days like all of us

No surprise then of how he posts on forums.

As I always post about the ulterior motive.

[RouletteGhost]

cht, he isnt the only leech to do it

bias wheels are few and far between, need feelers out there

he loses so he bashes people on forums

GF was not good enough as he only got to bash turbo....so now hes back here...like....a vampire


hes full of SHIT

[RouletteGhost]

Because Roulette wheels did have a bias the design has slowly evolved into the low profile, Corian ball track, single block of aluminium, moveable separator ring products presently available from the major manufacturers

Software has also been available now for around 20 years that enables operators to identify bias

[Steve]

shouldnt we have an AP section

There is a professional play section. But it's common for discussions about any topic to spill into other areas. It happens with any topic. I dont believe in strictly enforcing keeping things "on-topic" because conversations have a natural flow.

Man City won the Premier League BTW watched by 88,000 United fans

Soccer sucks balls. Just my opinion.

To stop the predatory tactics of people like the general

That wont stop anything. It is just inflammatory. Caleb knows trolling wont be tolerated. Again we all know how he can be sometimes. But you are not considering often he is attacked because of his unpopular explanations. His response is by antagonizing people who attack him. And from my own experience with him his behavior can sometimes be childish. But you pretty much everyone here plays up once in a while, including me. That's life. Look past it and look at shared knowledge before popularity or keeping peace. Caleb knows the limits and knows what happens if it goes over the line. We dont need to make a big hoo-hah about it all.

There simply isn’t enough biased wheels in this day and age.

From personal experience with data I see, there actually is. I should know. I see a lot of data. But still I advise my own players not to bother with bias unless you find a perfect wheel, because there are much better ways of beating roulette in my experience.

These wheels are monitored and are electronic
You need a nice size bias for it to be worth your while.

Yes but the monitors dont check sounds, or make visual observations. And they need a lot of data. An observant player can detect and exploit bias well before software has thousands of spins to analyze. Even when a rotor is changed on a wheel, it might create a bias the casino wont know about for weeks. But a bias player could exploit it in hours.

The wheels are manufactured differently now. Any bias is caught.

They are better-made, but they still wear down quite easily. If you've seen the state of many real casino wheels, you'd wonder how on earth the casino isnt broke. Some wheels are in terrible condition. And really its not that uncommon.

He’s full of shit. Like mr j has winning and losing days like all of us

Maybe he is. But like I said before, I agree with the majority of what he says. I dont know if he plays like he says. How can anyone but him know that? I'm judging him only on his knowledge. I know what the facts are from my own experience. I've been working with roulette nearly every day for 20 years. Its no exaggeration. Nobody knows everything, and I'll always keep an open mind. And I make up my mind based on test results, not what I think should be reality.

[RouletteGhost]

the tactics they ("AP" players) employ to detect wheel bias is simplistic to say the least

their "bias" can simply be normal wheel variance