Bread Winner for every bet

[GLC]

This topic is about a very stable bet method called the "Bread Winner".  It is presented in the Monte Carlo Anecdotes, an e-book you can read on-line for free.  There's a chapter titled "The Bread Winner System" page 160.  Or, you can read the following topic on another forum for a little better explanation:


link:://:.casinomeister.com/forums/skill-games/33977-bread-winner-system-roulette.html


Now, I'm going to apply this same method to each of the bet locations on the table.


Even Chance is 1:1  You must lose 5 units betting 1 unit per spin before moving to 2 units for recovery.  Each win at 2 units recovers 2 of the five 1's.


Dozens is 2:1   You must lose 10 units betting 1 unit per spin before moving to 2 units for recovery.  Each win at 2 units recovers 4 of the ten 1's.


Line is 5:1   You must lose 25 units betting 1 unit per spin before moving to 2 units for recovery.  Each win at 2 units recovers 10 of the twenty-five 1's.


Corner is 8:1   You must lose 40 units betting 1 unit per spin before moving to 2 units for recovery.  Each win at 2 units recovers 16 of the forty 1's.


Street is 11:1   You must lose 55 units betting 1 unit per spin before moving to 2 units for recovery.  Each win at 2 units recovers 22 of the fifty-five 1's.


Split is 17:1   You must lose 85 units betting 1 unit per spin before moving to 2 units for recovery.  Each win at 2 units recovers 34 of the eighty-five 1's.


Straight up is 35:1   You must lose 175 units betting 1 unit per spin before moving to 2 units for recovery.  Each win at 2 units recovers 70 of the one hundred seventy-five 1's.


How does the above help us?


If you like the bread winner system, then you should like the other systems also.  Just takes a tad longer to play.


What about double dozens?  Can someone help us know how many 1's we need before we can move to 2 units on each of the two dozens?


What about the 3/2 bet?  We should be able to come to a formula for that one also.


If the bread winner is a strong betting system for the even chances, why wouldn't it be a strong betting system for the other bets also?


Help me out here, please.


GLC

[albalaha]

Dear George,
           I do believe in sensible progressions but the way you want to use this progression upon different bets is not digestible to me. Why should one wait to lose 55 units on a street before using any progression? Is it a bread earner progression? How do you justify it? If someone wants to use safest progression, one should go for pluscoup progression.

[GLC]

Dear George,
           I do believe in sensible progressions but the way you want to use this progression upon different bets is not digestible to me. Why should one wait to lose 55 units on a street before using any progression? Is it a bread earner progression? How do you justify it? If someone wants to use safest progression, one should go for pluscoup progression.

Al,

I am not suggesting that we use any of these progressions beyond the even chance.

I have had good results playing this "bread winner" method on e.c.'s and decided to apply the same principles that make up the bet on even chances to all the other bets for all to see and "maybe" come up with an idea for a better way to bet their favorite bet selection.

I think Winkel's "win as much as you want" system uses some of this concept and that method has gotten some attention by a few members.  We never know what might trigger a new idea that could have some merit.

GLC

[GLC]

I'm not a mathematics expert, but I think I have calculated the formula for applying the bread winner method to 2 dozens, 5 lines and 11 streets.

The bread winner is based on losing 5 times the payout or on an even chance game that equals 5 units since the payout is 1:1.  That's even money.  By going to 2 units at the next level, we must win 2.5 times to recover the 5 lost units.

Double dozens:  If we are betting 1 unit on 2 dozens/columns and we lose 5 times that means we have lost 10 units since we lose 2 units every loss.  To recover 10 units in 2.5 wins, we will have to bet 4 units on each dozens.  This will net us 4 units each win times 2.5 equals 10 units recovered.

Five lines:  If we are betting 1 unit on 5 lines and we lose 5 times, that means we have lost 25 units since we lose 5 units every loss.  To recover 25 units in 2.5 wins, we will have to bet 10 units on each line.  This will net us 10 units each win times 2.5 equals 25 units recovered.

Eleven streets:  If we are betting 1 unit on 11 streets and we lose 5 times that means we have lost 55 units since we lose 11 units every loss.  To recover 55 units in 2.5 wins, we will have to bet 22 units on each street.  This will net us 22 units each win times 2.5 equals 55 units recovered.

Using the same forumula, we can calculate how much we will have to bet on each location to recover if we lose at the 2nd recovery level.  For the multiple bets, 2:1, 5:1 and 11:1 our bet sizes will escalate rapidly.  This is offset by the greater odds of not losing at any level and having to go to the next level for recovery.

For example:  Betting 5 lines we go from betting 1 unit at the 1st level to betting 10 units at the 2nd level, but we must remember that we have 5 more chances to win than lose (not considering the zero).

Are any of these playable besides the even chance and maybe the dozens? 

You'll have to decide that for yourself.

George

[albalaha]

This debate is very interesting but if we talk of mathematical aspects of it, math genius would say that it is all the same. No progression changes the odds of the game. If we look at its practical implication for playing any bet, be it an EC or a straight up number, in no way it looks like a bread earner apart from its name.  Will anybody do some testing upon these ideas and bring forth results?

[catalyst]

GLC -- The Master of Even chances .      

[GLC]

GLC -- The Master of Even chances .     

Cat,  Bayes just turned me on to a novel thought.  Since we always lose more bets than we win at roulette, the only way to beat the game is to be betting more when we win and we are betting when we lose.


Bingo!  Who'd have thought it.


That's exactly what this system does.


Unless you have the worst standard deviation imaginable, you should be able to grind out 10 units with this system every time. 


If your bet selection is letting you down that badly, you couldn't win with any progression.  Not even a flat bet.


You may have to have a hefty bankroll and a lot of time, but eventually you should get there.

With baccarat it should be even easier.

G

[ZeroBlue]

This debate is very interesting but if we talk of mathematical aspects of it, math genius would say that it is all the same. No progression changes the odds of the game. If we look at its practical implication for playing any bet, be it an EC or a straight up number, in no way it looks like a bread earner apart from its name.  Will anybody do some testing upon these ideas and bring forth results?

The Mathematical aspects say that It all resumes to betting a pattern will not happen, so the larger the pattern, thus the progression, the bigger the odds are to achieve a win.
Example
a straight even chance as 1 in two chances of win, of course every step of the progression deals with the same odds but the odds of getting the dreaded pattern are smaller and smaller.


a pattern of 10 outcomes has the following odds using a common progression.


2X2X2X2X2X2X2X2X2X2 = 1 IN 1024

1
2
4
8
16
32
64
128
256
512

=1023 UNITS


So this is the charm of roulette...


I know that this does not illustrate precisely the aim of the bread winner progression.


But will anyone say that with a progression the odds of hitting 51% are the same using flat bet or progression?


This reminds me of Pippen (NBA) recently say that Lebron James is a better all round player than Michael Jordan. Based on stats. But the accolade.. 

Will anybody do some testing upon these ideas and bring forth results?

the results with this sensible Money Management are among the best one can get. Regarding the natural flow of the distribution of an Even Chance  it will grind for many many spins and most of the time come out in profit. In this point we Must acknowledge it is a real Bread Winner and it deserves the name.


Will anybody do some testing and sink a progression before winning some bread?

[ZeroBlue]

28	17	18	25	30	10	X	O	X	O	X	X
1	30	6	27	23	30	X	O	O	X	X	O
25	5	6	17	16	34	X	X	O	X	O	O
4	28	19	15	10	7	X	X	O	O	X	O	W
24	26	15	25	15	1	X	X	O	O	O	O	LW
4	29	5	9	8	5	X	O	O	O	X	O	W
32	28	25	33	32	0	X	X	O	O	X	X	LW
1	33	34	30	36	31	X	X	O	O	O	X	LW
16	5	20	20	20	13	X	O	X	X	X	O	W
27	36	29	33	7	36	X	O	X	X	X	O	LLL
36	10	14	36	1	36	X	X	X	X	O	X
20	23	2	13	31	30	X	O	X	O	O	X	W
19	12	16	21	3	6	X	O	O	X	X	O	W
13	13	9	5	9	35	X	X	X	X	X	X	LW
13	29	13	19	29	28	X	X	X	X	X	O	LLW
34	27	33	17	20	34	X	O	O	O	X	X	W
26	29	17	35	0	19	X	O	O	O	X	O	LLW
35	22	16	31	26	11	X	O	O	X	O	X	W
32	25	27	35	4	33	X	O	O	O	X	O	W
36	6	3	27	35	3	X	X	O	O	O	O	LLW
9	29	23	31	29	17	X	X	X	X	X	X	LLW

S=SAME
O=OTHER

JUST BETTING AFTER LLL

+9 with 1-2-4 martingale
+1 flat bet
+4 bread winner

[ZeroBlue]

5	17	21	2	19	24	X	X	X	O	X	O
27	27	18	5	1	20	X	X	O	X	X	O
4	1	17	20	11	26	X	O	O	X	O	X
11	15	34	22	18	34	X	X	O	O	O	O	w
6	12	34	12	10	29	X	X	X	X	X	O	w
35	32	12	3	21	23	X	O	O	X	X	X	lw
18	33	20	10	6	1	X	O	X	X	X	O
15	16	14	23	15	16	X	O	O	X	X	O	llw
4	5	22	13	10	12	X	O	X	O	X	X	w
33	8	24	34	30	13	X	O	O	O	O	X	w
17	10	30	9	12	34	X	O	O	X	O	O	w
35	24	26	22	11	4	X	O	O	O	X	O	w
14	1	2	33	14	36	X	O	X	O	X	X	lll
24	34	4	10	11	4	X	X	X	X	O	X	lw
11	23	24	12	2	19	X	X	O	O	O	X	llw
32	19	22	31	35	31	X	O	X	O	O	O	lw
32	17	1	26	16	17	X	O	O	X	X	O	w
19	24	26	31	1	23	X	O	O	X	X	X	llw
30	16	28	32	22	11	X	X	X	X	X	O	lw
26	26	18	17	18	12	X	X	X	O	X	X	w
5	1	20	7	3	33	X	X	O	X	X	X	w
36	23	12	34	12	14	X	O	X	X	X	X	w
21	33	15	27	24	0	X	X	X	X	O	O	w
18	0	30	15	2	5	X	X	X	O	X	O	w
25	19	30	6	1	24	X	X	O	O	X	O	w
11	5	14	3	36	5	X	X	O	X	O	X	w
36	19	8	27	12	17	X	O	X	O	X	O	w
8	5	31	13	1	22	X	O	O	O	O	X	w
29	20	4	17	30	30	X	O	O	X	O	O	w
23	24	24	10	19	15	X	O	O	O	X	X	w
20	27	28	32	29	13	X	O	X	X	O	O	w
0	16	22	11	31	25	X	X	X	O	O	O	lw
1	36	25	32	22	7	X	O	X	O	O	X	w
16	4	29	5	6	13	X	X	O	O	X	O	w
35	24	2	32	31	35	X	O	O	O	X	X	lll
25	31	28	21	35	9	X	X	O	X	X	X	w

Just this one more and i am done.

[sheki]

Hello, anybody paly this with EC, I think that this is looking good

[Ralph]

I have used it, and tweaked it. If I am back 3, I parlay the fourth if it is a win, if loss go up to two units.

Some think  we must use negative progression , they  use the argument, we can not win without it as it is not possible to win more spins than we lose. Other says it does not matter. I use both sometimes in the same method.

[GLC]

I have used it, and tweaked it. If I am back 3, I parlay the fourth if it is a win, if loss go up to two units.

Some think  we must use negative progression , they  use the argument, we can not win without it as it is not possible to win more spins than we lose. Other says it does not matter. I use both sometimes in the same method.

Very interesting tweak Ralph,


Thanks,


George

[catalyst]

Very interesting tweak Ralph,


Thanks,


George

i dont understand the tweak. someone please clarify it, preferebly George, thinking to incorporate in my system. thanks.

[jarabo002]

Yeah, an example with two dozens, please...and thanks!


Mr. GLC?